Most kog players duod and triod to t200... A very small amount got most clears from t0. And for the pros that don't clear mains so they have no points, that's on them xd
07:01
Not sure on the 'many' that don't deserve that spot
Apostle
Most kog players duod and triod to t200... A very small amount got most clears from t0. And for the pros that don't clear mains so they have no points, that's on them xd
ik that many players get to top 200 by team playing but if you have passed some hards in duo trio it doesn't make you pro
07:13
you may look at my profile on the site and see that i have almost 150 ranks with my friend and im in top200 but if you see how im playing you won't say that im pro
07:14
im simple player that can play 90% of hards in duo trio easily but i don't think that i deserve to be in KoG
1
07:14
i don't talk about others
07:16
everyone has their own opinion about themselves and thing that they deserve
Most kog players duod and triod to t200... A very small amount got most clears from t0. And for the pros that don't clear mains so they have no points, that's on them xd
kog clan has no much to do with the level of the players tho. if you're in the leaderboard you can apply and probably pass depending on your reputation
08:43
kog clan has never really been a clan of the best players. it started with qshar and his friends and then grew with the condition of having collected a lot of points on this mode (which means active players rather than skilled ones since the gap of points between difficulties was purposely very small, even overlapping)
too short for touching sky
im simple player that can play 90% of hards in duo trio easily but i don't think that i deserve to be in KoG
nowadays its easier to get into top 200 because there are so many easy maps, mains and hards so if you play enough you can get a lot of points. and a lot of pros dont really do that and just play insanes and they free up the leaderboard spots for others. also i feel like the difference in skill between top 10 and top 200 is much higher than it used to be. maybe the requirement would have to be made more strict to adapt to the current times but i doubt anyone from the kog team cares about that
it already went from 500 to 200 but points (in the current rating system) are not relevant to judge of the skill anyway.
btw if there are more ez and main maps, it's because noobs can't map insane (or it only awful maps) we recommand to the new mapper to make maps they can play on. So there won't be much insane in the future if old mappers are not making new maps, pros player still not willing to get into mapping and new mapper making ez ones. that probably won't change tho.
Mixi already worked on a new rating system which can handle this issue by reducing gap and overlapping points and give way more points for finishing insane maps.
beside of that, idk if kog clan has to recruit only the best player. i think it has never been intended to be like this. qshar wanted to gives a good amount of points for main in order to get mostly active players in a continuously refreshing leaderboard instead of a static list of ancient pro. things will change now with this rerating and let's see how it turns(edited)
ipoopi
nowadays its easier to get into top 200 because there are so many easy maps, mains and hards so if you play enough you can get a lot of points. and a lot of pros dont really do that and just play insanes and they free up the leaderboard spots for others. also i feel like the difference in skill between top 10 and top 200 is much higher than it used to be. maybe the requirement would have to be made more strict to adapt to the current times but i doubt anyone from the kog team cares about that
i wasnt saying anything about the ratio. there are also more hards and insanes too but more maps in general favour players that play a lot and farm fixed points
if everyone cared about fixed points then the leaderboards would work since everyone would have all the maps that are easy for them completed. maybe a weighted system kind of like in osu would work better where your hardest map finish would give 100% of the points that it's supposed to give and the easier maps would give less and less. so eg. your top 5 hardest map finishes would be like 50% of your total point count (numbers could be changed)
09:19
that would work even better with the new difficulty above insane
by the amount of points it gives. would mean that how much you gain from certain maps would need to be more thought out. but idk how would mod maps fit into that
09:30
wdym by source. its an idea, not a proof that it would be better
09:31
although it works in osu. and osu also used to have a system that just gave more points the more maps you played which was changed to a weighted system
maybe some another weighted system on top of that that rewards you for playing with people lower ranked than you and punishes for playing with higher ranked ppl, idk
and that would still require even more grinding because instead of just finishing bad main maps you would have to speedrun every single one of them to have a good rank in the leaderboard(edited)
also possible to reward more points for maps that arent boatable and have harder parts where you're not really allowed to fail
09:51
in top 100 theres like maybe 5 carried ppl. most of the leaderboard inaccuracy comes from pros not wanting to grind fixed points, not from others getting carried
im top 39 rn and i dont think ive ever been carried through a map. i dont really play with ppl that are much better than me. if i were ever carried then it was in a duo on a map that i could have easily finished in a bigger group anyway. and there are people that have less points than me but are better. but it happens because they all just dont want to farm fixed points or not play enough, not because i got carried.
definitely not an average of every rank. just something that counts only your best ranks. maybe also a weighted system where the best ranks give more. but imo its better without rank points overall. a lot of people dont care about ranks at all and they wouldnt like it if they suddenly had to. so depends on if ppl agree with roadrunner
The only logical improvement to the point ranking system (That I can see) would be a crossover of your fixed points, your season points and some % increase/decrease on points depending on your rank on said specific map.
(I.e. On Aip_Gores. Being top 1000 might give a small increase and being top 100 a further increase and top 50 even further and so on.)
Fixed Points: It takes skill to finish maps. The more maps you CAN finish, the more skill you generally have, hence why Fixed points exists. If you choose to not finish a map, that is up to you. But, generally, more finished maps = more skilled player
Season Points: If you finish a map again, you are rewarded for being active and not being a "one hit wonder". However, this is a map you have finished before and thus, your points are only seasonal = they can/will fall off.
New (Potential) Addition: Obviously it requires skill to complete a map faster. Getting a Rank 1 on a map is notably harder than getting rank 250. This achievement could be rewarded.
Of course you can grind a map for hours and hours on end, and then get a rank that might not realistically reflect on your actual skill level, however, I think this should be rewarded as well, since we've already established that activity is rewarded alongside skill.
The point system is not there to ONLY reflect on your skill level. This is important to remember. It is supposed to reward activity too.
Now, I'm not a member of KoG staff, but I can rather safely assume that they, of course, want their players to be as skilled as humanly possible. Alongside this, they also want a big player base, in which their players play a lot. For a community to not only survive but to even prosper, you need active members and growth (New members).
Without either activity or growth, the community will eventually die. So for me it is just basic logic to reward this positive behaviour.
KoG wants Skill & Activity, so they choose to reward this with the point system.(edited)
The only logical improvement to the point ranking system (That I can see) would be a crossover of your fixed points, your season points and some % increase/decrease on points depending on your rank on said specific map.
(I.e. On Aip_Gores. Being top 1000 might give a small increase and being top 100 a further increase and top 50 even further and so on.)
Fixed Points: It takes skill to finish maps. The more maps you CAN finish, the more skill you generally have, hence why Fixed points exists. If you choose to not finish a map, that is up to you. But, generally, more finished maps = more skilled player
Season Points: If you finish a map again, you are rewarded for being active and not being a "one hit wonder". However, this is a map you have finished before and thus, your points are only seasonal = they can/will fall off.
New (Potential) Addition: Obviously it requires skill to complete a map faster. Getting a Rank 1 on a map is notably harder than getting rank 250. This achievement could be rewarded.
Of course you can grind a map for hours and hours on end, and then get a rank that might not realistically reflect on your actual skill level, however, I think this should be rewarded as well, since we've already established that activity is rewarded alongside skill.
The point system is not there to ONLY reflect on your skill level. This is important to remember. It is supposed to reward activity too.
Now, I'm not a member of KoG staff, but I can rather safely assume that they, of course, want their players to be as skilled as humanly possible. Alongside this, they also want a big player base, in which their players play a lot. For a community to not only survive but to even prosper, you need active members and growth (New members).
Without either activity or growth, the community will eventually die. So for me it is just basic logic to reward this positive behaviour.
KoG wants Skill & Activity, so they choose to reward this with the point system. (edited)
I think the same reasoning applies to the KoG clan (The arguments in my previous post). It was never meant to be exclusive for the best players. It was for the ones who are skilled, active AND willing to put down time in the commnity.
Therefor, I can understand how the "older" pros might look at the clan now and just see a bunch of random players.
But for the majority of players, the ones who still grind on main/hard and easier insane maps. They will look at the majority of the KoG clan and think. Yeah, those players deserve to be there.(edited)
Taking the information provided by others above. It started with Qshar and his friends, extended to a few other prominent members of the community and then evolved into what it was today.
Taking the information provided by others above. It started with Qshar and his friends, extended to a few other prominent members of the community and then evolved into what it was today.
I don't assume that @Beautemps was lying about that information because if he was I'd expect someone else to correct him. So I went with that information, applied some commons sense and came with an argument.
Still the argument/point still stands. It's for the most active and prominent members of the community. If you are INCREDIBLY skilled but don't want to play easier maps nor want to participate in the KoG community clan, that is up to you. No one can force you to do that.
But if you as a pro, leave your spot open for someone else, then someone else will take that spot. If all pros think like this, then obviously we are left with a clan that doesn't include the best players.
This is not the fault of the new KoG members, nor KoG itself. It's the choice of said pros that lead to this result.
Mixi
if you consider kog from 2015, well yea most of members were pros back then
tbh level increased a lot as i watched old videos and basically maps rating from 2015 so idk if ppl who were called pro can still be in regard of this (i mean some of them are still active and progressed a lot to what we can consider pro today)(edited)
KOF
Extrime is r1 on the hardest gores maps like ring of gores 3 and square of gores 2, best player of all time.
Still the argument/point still stands. It's for the most active and prominent members of the community. If you are INCREDIBLY skilled but don't want to play easier maps nor want to participate in the KoG community clan, that is up to you. No one can force you to do that.
But if you as a pro, leave your spot open for someone else, then someone else will take that spot. If all pros think like this, then obviously we are left with a clan that doesn't include the best players.
This is not the fault of the new KoG members, nor KoG itself. It's the choice of said pros that lead to this result.
Great. Then that is that. You chose to not be there. You left your spot, someone else will fill that spot. Not saying that they have done more for the community nor are better than you. They are just the next in line
Being active, following rules (majority of times) and representing the community in a positive way. Is to me, a GREAT way of being a part of an online community
I can agree with the fact that there might be too many and especially too many that haven't played in years. They could be removed from the clan. But by just being a good sport on severs, you are encouraging that behaviour to others
just stop this trashtalk about behaving good I just cant listen to that
Bʟυɛ ♡
Being active, following rules (majority of times) and representing the community in a positive way. Is to me, a GREAT way of being a part of an online community
this is not totally wrong tho. it's quiet often a pleasure to play with kog members in t0 or so. but it doesn't rly mean anything xd like many players are good guys and very active without being kog members
I can name a couple of players that have done a lot for the community, just "raising" new players to learn how to act, behave and play around others. Not by using moderator tools nor by confronting anyone. Just being themselves and playing in a proper manner.
There are plenty of examples. I can go through a list of everyone I've ever played with and name multiple people that fit my description. But that doesn't add anything, it doesn't prove anything. I've named one, that's proof enough. They are there and they are helping the community, that is just a fact.
The same goes for a lot of these KoG clan players, just saying "they don't do anything, they don't care" because they aren't as active on social media as others is just blatantly wrong and an insult
I can mention a lot of players, making a full list of everyone will take time. I will forget a few and probably not reflect honestly on other regions outside of the EU. But making this list would take time, so this conversation would end.
Bʟυɛ ♡
I can mention a lot of players, making a full list of everyone will take time. I will forget a few and probably not reflect honestly on other regions outside of the EU. But making this list would take time, so this conversation would end.
You want me to name all the players that fit my description, that is the problem. I can name people right now if you want that, but it won't be the most influential nor everyone. But it will include people I can think of just out of the back of my head(edited)
16:26
But I can start typing if that is what you want.(edited)
Destro, PeBox, Hiddentest, Syntax, Heyng, Secret, KingJulius, GoldDigga, Miiep¨*, Route66, Weedman, Waschlappen, Stonemin.
These are the first few that I can think of
But as someone who plays on all EU servers and on all skill levels, I can honestly say, that I've seen these people a lot, and they are good people, very skilled too, that provide the server and community with a lot of good energy. Calm, friendly, helpful and in general, provide a pleasant gaming experience
It's quite easy. If no one plays on the community servers, there is no community. So being a player is helping the community. Same as subscribing to a Youtuber, in a sense
16:45
That being said, you don't necessarily add any values to the community just being there
That's why I mentioned these specific players. I'd argue they provide the servers with a safe environment, they are fun to play with, but alongside that they are helpful to beginners and intermediate players. What is especially important about these players is that they are players that others look up to.
Seeing how these people act, with how many others who look up to them is adding great value to the community.
Well, @Mixi It's quite simple. If no one played on the servers. There wouldn't be any, they would be shut down. Hence, the community would die. If you play, without ever speaking nor contributing outside of the simple fact that you play on the servers. You are still helping the servers stay afloat, by showing that there is interest in this community
But if you are one of those who "just play" but you also do that whilst following rules, being helpful and friendly and supportive. You will create a good environment as well as foster/raise the newer people into also doing that.
1
16:55
Therefor you are being more helpful to the server than other people
So, this all goes back to the conversation we had before. Where you said that the KoG clan is useless and provide nothing and they don't care. While that is true for some members, nothing is ever perfect, many of the people you dismiss as randoms actually provide the community with some of the effects a moderator have
So, this all goes back to the conversation we had before. Where you said that the KoG clan is useless and provide nothing and they don't care. While that is true for some members, nothing is ever perfect, many of the people you dismiss as randoms actually provide the community with some of the effects a moderator have
A moderator is someone who is there to control, enlighten and also punish people. If someone else have raised these newer people to just act in a manner that is deemed ok by KoG standards. They are being helpful to the community
@Smash That is outside of the point. He just said name people that fit my description, and I did. Being in KoG or not wasn't part of the equation for that statement. I just denied his statement that you can't be important/helpful to a community by just playing and being yourself
it was about role of moderators, kog clan and other useless things you said not about people you mentioned contributing to community, their contribution is the same as any other random players
The majority of the player base is still playing on Easy/Main servers. Showing these newer people how to play and act around others is important for the community
I agree with @ipoopi however, as a person who has spent a lot of time online as well as working in a customer service centered profession for many years. Sadly, common sense is rarer than you would like. Hence, having players (preferably good players) that also act correctly, can steer others into doing the same.
I agree with @ipoopi however, as a person who has spent a lot of time online as well as working in a customer service centered profession for many years. Sadly, common sense is rarer than you would like. Hence, having players (preferably good players) that also act correctly, can steer others into doing the same.
if someone is braindead enough to not have common sense about how you interact with other humans then seeing some rando being nice to others wont change anything for them regardless of the rando being a good player or not
@Krumplee Yes of course, that's why we have moderators. I never said anything against that. But if they never broke the rules in the first place, because someone was a good role model to them. That would mean less work for moderators, more chill servers and over-all a better time for everyone
assholes dont have role models. you probably need some modesty and respect to others to look up to someone enough to call them a role model
ipoopi
if someone is braindead enough to not have common sense about how you interact with other humans then seeing some rando being nice to others wont change anything for them regardless of the rando being a good player or not
That is not really something that can be argued about. That is basic human behaviour. Younger people and less intelligent people, generally people who can't really think for themselves will follow someone else's orders/opinions.
Quinn
@Krumplee you stinker I’m gonna toast all your bread and put it back in the packaging
kog servers arent a kindergarten idk. your pro player role model should have been a teacher in kindergarten when you were 4 to tell you that being nice is nice and not being nice is not nice
kog servers arent a kindergarten idk. your pro player role model should have been a teacher in kindergarten when you were 4 to tell you that being nice is nice and not being nice is not nice
Yes, I agree with you. But here we are, people are still behaving like children, people are throwing insults around and people aren't following rules.
17:23
So we need moderators to make sure the servers are enjoyable to play on. And if we have a lot of good players that are good role models, we can make the lives of the moderators easier.
17:24
We might need less moderators, they have more free time and they can focus more on actually enjoying the game and making improvements #ripkog2.0
17:24
Basicly, all I am saying is that there are people that are helpful to the community without being a moderator
idk if theres a single person that was going to call a main player an n-word for failing a save but thought "krumplee wouldnt do that!" and refrained from that
Well if that is your first thought after someone fails a save, you probably belong to that category of people who won't change no matter what and in this case we'd have to rely on moderators and their help.
But there are people who have been toxic, who have been trolling around and making the servers less entertaining to play on. Not necessarily being bad enough to get banned but enough to make things less enjoyable.
They can be steered into a right direction. Not as blatantly as "I like that player and he wouldn't say this or do that". But a combination of maturing and the fact that the people you look up to act accordingly
17:29
I'm not saying that having 1 good role model turns you into a saint and saves the server. No one is stupid enough to believe that. But these people constantly providing a safe, enjoyable environment are helping others to steer into that direction
17:30
Not everyone and it won't make them perfect. But it helps
idk, maybe that happens one day. then the role model player gets a +1 community contribution point and now officially contributes more than some rando player by 0,1%
idk, maybe that happens one day. then the role model player gets a +1 community contribution point and now officially contributes more than some rando player by 0,1%
Yeah to some extend you are correct. It might not help with much. Just one player being good won't do much. But the more people that are being good role-models, the more people will take after them, which means even more role-models in future etc.
Basically, I disagreed with @Mixi stating that most KoG Clan players are useless and/or don't care/contribute to the community in any way, shape or form.
17:36
And it somehow lead to this
17:36
But I feel like we've been through it all, and I'm getting tired of typing
I love fng — Today at 18:11
1) they arent active
2) they dont care about community
I love fng — Today at 18:13
they arent doing anything for the community
I think its hilarious u kids are talking shit about KoG members. u wouldnt say this shit to them irl, they're jacked. not only that but they wear the freshest clothes, eat at the chillest restaurants and hang out with the hottest dudes. yall are pathetic lol
I think its hilarious u kids are talking shit about KoG members. u wouldnt say this shit to them irl, they're jacked. not only that but they wear the freshest clothes, eat at the chillest restaurants and hang out with the hottest dudes. yall are pathetic lol
KoG clan is supposed to represent relatively skilled/active players, that also follow guidelines and generally provide a nice gaming experience. Atleast that is the impression I have gotten from the KoG clan today. That being said, I don't think everyone who is in the KoG clan right now should be there.
But isn't that why they need to have a certain amount of points (top200) and need to be accepted through a voting procedure. To filter out those who don't fit
Xin
I think its hilarious u kids are talking shit about KoG members. u wouldnt say this shit to them irl, they're jacked. not only that but they wear the freshest clothes, eat at the chillest restaurants and hang out with the hottest dudes. yall are pathetic lol
people that dont fit into kog are voting whether some other random fits into kog
1
Bʟυɛ ♡
But isn't that why they need to have a certain amount of points (top200) and need to be accepted through a voting procedure. To filter out those who don't fit
Well, I haven't said there aren't issues with the system. But if someone is in the top200 and is completely unfitting to be a part of the clan. I'd assume there never even is a vote.
Bʟυɛ ♡
Well, I haven't said there aren't issues with the system. But if someone is in the top200 and is completely unfitting to be a part of the clan. I'd assume there never even is a vote.
I think its hilarious u kids are talking shit about KoG members. u wouldnt say this shit to them irl, they're jacked. not only that but they wear the freshest clothes, eat at the chillest restaurants and hang out with the hottest dudes. yall are pathetic lol
oh wait that was why sasukey and delete was declined i think
17:59
why are we even arguing tho
17:59
there are no servers
Route66
Is the reason for all those recent server crashes known? And is anybody even working on it?
Would be cool to give some updates to the community, since we are playing for almost two weeks with constant server crashes every hour
This is how I see it, not that it actually matters to anyone else. But I'd like to think of myself as impartial and objective, so read through if you are interested.
No one is perfect, everyone has their bad days and even the friendliest and calmest person can rage on someone once in a while. Shiet happens, unfortunately, that's life.
But if you are toxic majority of time, or have been caught cheating or banned/muted for racism etc. The major "no-no's", so to speak. You shouldn't be allowed in to the KoG clan. (except, maybe (keyword maybe) if there has been a extended period of time where you have proven you matured or moved away from such behaviours, couple years later, idk). So the vote shouldn't even appear in these scenarios (in my opinion, just instant decline)
But if you haven't broken any rules and been generally a good person, "spreading good vibes" and all that jazz. Then start the vote and KoG clan votes. HOPEFULLY in this stage, the KoG clan members will be mature enough to vote for people that are FITTING and not only their friends.
This all does heavily rely on the fact that the KoG clan has a generally mature player base and the people inside it as of right now fit in the description as well.
1) I think that they should HAVE to give a reason when voting. Whether or not it's F4, blank or F3, giving a reason supporting your vote is never a bad idea. It can only make things better, clearer and more informative
2) If you dislike someone, you have a reason for disliking them. This would be made clear if you had to type a reason behind your vote. If your reason is actually just bs this would show and if you refuse to type a reason your vote just shouldn't count.
3) If your reason is valid, but you wish to not make it public you could just message a staff member of choice and they can present it further to the team anonymously.(edited)
1) I think that they should HAVE to give a reason when voting. Whether or not it's F4, blank or F3, giving a reason supporting your vote is never a bad idea. It can only make things better, clearer and more informative
2) If you dislike someone, you have a reason for disliking them. This would be made clear if you had to type a reason behind your vote. If your reason is actually just bs this would show and if you refuse to type a reason your vote just shouldn't count.
3) If your reason is valid, but you wish to not make it public you could just message a staff member of choice and they can present it further to the team anonymously. (edited)
I don't know much about the map-testing procedure and what is allowed, but if you ever need more opinions, I'm sure just asking some active members like myself wouldn't hurt. I don't think I'm that knowledgeable about rating maps and I don't have much experience but I'd gladly help, only if casually
obviouly not for the current problem because youd need to learn the kog code etc but for future maintenance
Bʟυɛ ♡
I don't know much about the map-testing procedure and what is allowed, but if you ever need more opinions, I'm sure just asking some active members like myself wouldn't hurt. I don't think I'm that knowledgeable about rating maps and I don't have much experience but I'd gladly help, only if casually
I understand that. But it surely is better than nothing, right?. And people that have played as much as me or more generally have a decent understanding of maps and their rating. If you ask 10 people and they all say Main 3, maybe there is some information to be grabbed from that
Yeah that is true, I mean people will get hurt since it's their names on that list and they are being compared to others, but you have got to take it with a bit of salt. It doesn't sound too serious to me nor should it be taken too serious either
But as long as you don't type "you are last because you are.." and then list everything negative about them mixed with some insults, I'd think you'd be fine
@Mixi Even though we have spammed the discord with hundreds of messages and didn't really come to a point. I do think we had some healthy discussions and shed light on important subjects as well as brought out some decent arguments. Hopefully the staff will read through at least some of it.
@Mixi Even though we have spammed the discord with hundreds of messages and didn't really come to a point. I do think we had some healthy discussions and shed light on important subjects as well as brought out some decent arguments. Hopefully the staff will read through at least some of it.
About the voting: We had an KoG internal discussion about the voting and many player participated on it. This new voting system was made by the community and not by the staff team. There was a voting and each KoG Member was able to vote for his/her favourite solution. This vote resulted in the new voting system
18:31
I can post the rules here if anybody is interested
It doesn't matter what I personally think about it, because the clan should be community-oriented. And the generality of the clan wanted a new voting system. I thought the old voting system was not bad either, but it had its weaknesses
It's just a suggestion, of course.
But the communities that I have been a part of before. (As in a part of the administrative team).
You had to state a reason for your vote, as long as you vote F3 or F4. You had to clarify why some one is either deemed qualified as well as why they aren't deemed qualified. If any of your reasoning was deemed invalid or Irrelevant your vote was moved from F3/F4 to blank, unless you could state another reason, ofc.
But just blindly voting for friends is equally harmful as gatekeeping your "enemies".
I think it could be very healthy to implement a system like this. Especially when there is a lot of "controversy" surrounding who can be a member and who can't. The community seems a bit divided and some feel like they aren't given a proper chance.
I think this could help.
Of course, this is just an opinion/suggestion, nothing more than that.(edited)
There was a voting channel but it got deleted months ago after the voting
18:42
Idk how many people voted back then
18:43
but I pinged KoG Members several time during those events
18:44
so everyone who was active at this time had the chance to vote
Bʟυɛ ♡
It's just a suggestion, of course.
But the communities that I have been a part of before. (As in a part of the administrative team).
You had to state a reason for your vote, as long as you vote F3 or F4. You had to clarify why some one is either deemed qualified as well as why they aren't deemed qualified. If any of your reasoning was deemed invalid or Irrelevant your vote was moved from F3/F4 to blank, unless you could state another reason, ofc.
But just blindly voting for friends is equally harmful as gatekeeping your "enemies".
I think it could be very healthy to implement a system like this. Especially when there is a lot of "controversy" surrounding who can be a member and who can't. The community seems a bit divided and some feel like they aren't given a proper chance.
I think this could help.
Of course, this is just an opinion/suggestion, nothing more than that. (edited)
Even though the system I just provided is very simplified and there is a lot more surrounding the vote that needs to be done. I feel like it would decrease the effectiveness of people Gatekeeping or people just blindly letting friends through, compared to the current system.
That being said, the new system is REALLY new so I don't think they'd change it again quite this soon. We might just have to wait a little, give it some time and see if there still seems to be problems in the nearby future(edited)
Bʟυɛ ♡
Even though the system I just provided is very simplified and there is a lot more surrounding the vote that needs to be done. I feel like it would decrease the effectiveness of people Gatekeeping or people just blindly letting friends through, compared to the current system.
That being said, the new system is REALLY new so I don't think they'd change it again quite this soon. We might just have to wait a little, give it some time and see if there still seems to be problems in the nearby future (edited)
Yes and if the administrative team sees this behaviour continuing under a longer period of time. They should probably step in and force-fully change it to something that is equally as democratic but less forgiving to "blind votes" and "Invalid reasoning"
if youre friends with someone who wants to join then its easy to come up with a good reason to f3 them so blindly f3ing friends isnt really fixable unless youre also required to comment on their skill in the reasoning with some good proof that theyre skilled enough
It's just a suggestion, of course.
But the communities that I have been a part of before. (As in a part of the administrative team).
You had to state a reason for your vote, as long as you vote F3 or F4. You had to clarify why some one is either deemed qualified as well as why they aren't deemed qualified. If any of your reasoning was deemed invalid or Irrelevant your vote was moved from F3/F4 to blank, unless you could state another reason, ofc.
But just blindly voting for friends is equally harmful as gatekeeping your "enemies".
I think it could be very healthy to implement a system like this. Especially when there is a lot of "controversy" surrounding who can be a member and who can't. The community seems a bit divided and some feel like they aren't given a proper chance.
I think this could help.
Of course, this is just an opinion/suggestion, nothing more than that. (edited)
if youre friends with someone who wants to join then its easy to come up with a good reason to f3 them so blindly f3ing friends isnt really fixable unless youre also required to comment on their skill in the reasoning with some good proof that theyre skilled enough
And administrative team checks the reasoning and sees if it rings true. They also have to compare all reasonings to each other. If everyone votes F4 and reasons are something like, them being toxic and then 1 guy who is a known friend votes F3 and says "Friendliest guy alive" then it would be quite obvious that there is something fishy going on.
The version I stated is super simplified but it is the basics of the system. It's up to the staff to confirm each vote.(edited)
(I.e.) 5 - F3 votes, 20 - B votes, 3 - F4 votes. (B = blank). Here the majority is overwhelmingly blank. This means majority of people doesn't know this person, then it should be considered to decline. However, this ought to be VERY rare, since they have to be top200.
Basically the "blank" vote would only be an option if you either A) Don't know the person enough to make a valid reason or B) your reasoning was deemed invalid and moved to blank.
yeah you could have seen a person on server but not really know enough about their skill or their personality
Bʟυɛ ♡
Basically the "blank" vote would only be an option if you either A) Don't know the person enough to make a valid reason or B) your reasoning was deemed invalid and moved to blank.
(I.e.) 5 - F3 votes, 20 - B votes, 3 - F4 votes. (B = blank). Here the majority is overwhelmingly blank. This means majority of people doesn't know this person, then it should be considered to decline. However, this ought to be VERY rare, since they have to be top200.
You do raise an interesting point. I don't know much about Alina and her situation, so I won't use her as an example.
But if someone were to ONLY play in team from day 1 until the day they apply for KoG (obviously having enough points etc.). And they've refrained from ever interacting with the community in any other way. That being on discord, team 0 chat etc.
I am not sure if I think they should be able to get accepted to join the clan. Sure, they might be skilled enough and might be a great person. But if no one can confirm this except the team said person played with, in other words, their friends. It suddenly becomes hard...
It's definitely a grey zone
But with the voting system that I described, there should be a overwhelming majority of "blank" votes. To an extent of it becoming the exception I mentioned earlier
crack
Currently our devs aren't available. That's why we're not able to fix that issue in the next couple of days
If this system is the one Crack posted, then from a logical perspective you were right imo. stands for "feeling that the player should not be in the clan". Therefore every should also be counted as .
From what i know he doesnt even have access to anything, because they keep it super private, which as you can see is bad for the community, their leadership struggles.. @crack how about getting new devs on board for just server side development?
Probably smart if all info ran through the Admin team. Which as far as I know is only Crack, Gummi and Haw. I'd be surprised if one of the 3 admins decided to leak things. And it could probably prove helpful if they could ask/answer questions, to some extent(edited)
Bʟυɛ ♡
Probably smart if all info ran through the Admin team. Which as far as I know is only Crack, Gummi and Haw. I'd be surprised if one of the 3 admins decided to leak things. And it could probably prove helpful if they could ask/answer questions, to some extent (edited)
I am included. When I talk with Avo he explains me everything he does. But since he is on vacation at the moment I don't want to annoy him with server issues every day. I already informed him about the problems we have right now. Since he hasn't looked at the problem yet, I don't know what the cause is
I know. They aren't devs. But they should probably have SOME insight into what is going on. Judging by what @Brokecdx- said they have nothing. But I don't know if that is true
crack
I am included. When I talk with Avo he explains me everything he does. But since he is on vacation at the moment I don't want to annoy him with server issues every day. I already informed him about the problems we have right now. Since he hasn't looked at the problem yet, I don't know what the cause is
From what i know he doesnt even have access to anything, because they keep it super private, which as you can see is bad for the community, their leadership struggles.. @crack how about getting new devs on board for just server side development?
I mean, you can't ask too much from them (the admin team). If they aren't devs themselves they can only try to understand. They won't randomly look at it and be like "HEY, I FIGURED IT OUT".(edited)
We do have a word on that but until now most of the stuff was fixable by Avo alone. Now he is not available for a longer period of time and now we have this bug which is just unfortunate
I can see it from both sides here.
For them (Dev and admin team) it's like their passion project. They don't want to just let anyone have a go at it and possibly ruin things. And if they know they can fix it (in time) it's "safer" to do it themselves.
But you are correct @Brokecdx- . Just having 1 main developer available is an issue. Obviously one person can't be available 24/7. Breaks are needed and life happens too. If something bad happens in that certain period that they are gone, it can quickly turn into a very unfortunate situation. Similar to what we have going on now(edited)
Thanks for having a discussion with us @crack Sometimes there is only complaining going on in discord, but tonight we're actually having an adult discussion with suggestions, arguments and information. Glad to see team is also taking a part of it.
Thanks for having a discussion with us @crack Sometimes there is only complaining going on in discord, but tonight we're actually having an adult discussion with suggestions, arguments and information. Glad to see team is also taking a part of it.
You're welcome. It's not possible to please everyone everytime but we're also trying our best. I'm sorry for the crashes at the moment. I would do something if I could but I actually can't in this situation
Perhaps the contents of our discussions should have included a bit more variety, thereby decreasing the overuse of single words from my end. However, for this particular instance, I take full responsibility of my actions.(edited)