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DDraceNetwork
Development / developer
Development discussion. Logged to https://ddnet.org/irclogs/ Connected with DDNet's IRC channel, Matrix room and GitHub repositories — IRC: #ddnet on Quakenet | Matrix: #ddnet-developer:matrix.org GitHub: https://github.com/ddnet
Between 2024-07-02 00:00:00Z and 2024-07-03 00:00:00Z
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 01:36:22Z
The minecraft community is big on version translation. But I guess that is because the actual official game it self just breaks versions all the time xd
Replying to @Tater I actually don't know of any other multiplayer games that keep compatabi…
01:37
@Tater: it’s just sad that latest ddnet does not even have the full list :P
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Minecraft is quite interesting but that's a unique situation where only the server is controller by the developers so they can't control the client at all.
01:40
In a way ddnet is the same but we still add plenty of client features that depend on server functionality so it's not really the same
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 01:42:08Z
Was that proxy ever in use? How does it work? Does every user need one to connect to a server? Or can a server Hoster slap it in front of a server? If every user needs it it’s a bit annoying. And I guess servers have no full proxy support so they would think all players joined through the proxy are coming from one ip address.
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 01:53:36Z
What was the accident xd
Replying to @heinrich5991 chillerdragon: yea. I (accidentally) took a break from ddnet, but it was…
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ChillerDragon BOT 2024-07-02 02:02:57Z
Amazing thanks
Replying to @Patiga some of those might be nits, please take them as suggestions :)
02:08
We test the cuirect and stuff like that logic already in unit tests right? So what’s missing is probably generating a screenshot and doing a image diff.
Replying to @heinrich5991 ChillerDragon: yes! tests are cool, and designing a nice test system is …
02:11
What why? ssh is great? I don’t get it
Replying to @heinrich5991 ChillerDragon: aged like milk :p
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ChillerDragon BOT 2024-07-02 02:17:19Z
Oh that’s good to know! Thanks for sharing. I never had the problem that the WiFi website does not pop up but it might happen some day. Makes a lot of sense never thought about it.
Replying to @Learath2 Oh also, neverssl.com is quite useful if you ever find yourself struggli…
02:23
Xd
Replying to @meloƞ same - the 20pair packs are insane
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 02:31:25Z
Yikes
Replying to @Ewan Screenshot_20240701-163218.png
02:32
Debian BTW
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$ wget https://raw.githubusercontent.com/teeworlds/teeworlds/a1911c8f7d8458fb4076ef8e7651e8ef5e91ab3e/datasrc/mapres/winter_main.png -O winter_main_0.7.png $ dilate winter_main_0.7.png https://github.com/ChillerDragon/ddnet/issues/8
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Debian FTW
Replying to chillerdragon Debian BTW
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chillerdragon
Debian BTW
Debian was my first big love
06:23
But its too old 🥲 (edited)
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morning
06:43
gentoo ftw
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mornin!
06:49
I Use arch btw
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Competitiveness is a vice of mine. When I heard that a friend got Linux to boot off of NFS, I had to one-up her. I had to prove that I could create...
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@Scrumplex are u around for some nixos troubleshooting
06:58
im a noob
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Ewan
@Scrumplex are u around for some nixos troubleshooting
I know the basics - and scrumpi taught me sum. Maybe i can Help
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On phone atm but here's the gist I have a flake that I wanna use as my system config https://github.com/ewancg/shit
my shit. Contribute to ewancg/shit development by creating an account on GitHub.
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Now put /boot on cloud too. Write an efi driver for cloud fs
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Ewan
On phone atm but here's the gist I have a flake that I wanna use as my system config https://github.com/ewancg/shit
in nixos dir
07:17
ewan@machine ~/shit (main)> nixos-rebuild --flake ./nixos#machine build building the system configuration... error: … while calling the 'head' builtin at /nix/store/g83ji892byw4wd81rmb14v69yrhq408s-source/lib/attrsets.nix:1575:11: 1574| || pred here (elemAt values 1) (head values) then 1575| head values | ^ 1576| else … while evaluating the attribute 'value' at /nix/store/g83ji892byw4wd81rmb14v69yrhq408s-source/lib/modules.nix:809:9: 808| in warnDeprecation opt // 809| { value = builtins.addErrorContext "while evaluating the option `${showOption loc}':" value; | ^ 810| inherit (res.defsFinal') highestPrio; (stack trace truncated; use '--show-trace' to show the full trace) error: getting status of '/nix/store/pz24qq8rhnc918bg0n31xpli9fs3vz82-source/.config': No such file or directory
07:17
It's evil
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Which File exactly ?
07:21
Looks Like a Syntax Error or Typo in one of your modules
07:21
Are you correctly importing it ?
07:28
On phone myself so hard to Doublecheck lmao
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ya i mean
07:37
im not sure it's an issue w my flake necessarily
07:38
ppl seem to have a similar issue with like 3 different proposed obscene fixes (edited)
07:38
i tried any that were applicable and had no luck
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So ist seems to be an issue with git beeing annoying lmao - maybe mv out the .git folder to be sure its not that, i dont remember running into that issue tho.
07:48
need git metadata for the flake anyway
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chillerdragon
Was that proxy ever in use? How does it work? Does every user need one to connect to a server? Or can a server Hoster slap it in front of a server? If every user needs it it’s a bit annoying. And I guess servers have no full proxy support so they would think all players joined through the proxy are coming from one ip address.
chillerdragon: both worked. no, the proxy was compiled into the server, but it roughly only had one intersection point
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chillerdragon
What was the accident xd
chillerdragon: I didn't check the ddnet discord, I did not make an explicit decision not to (edited)
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ChillerDragon
What why? ssh is great? I don’t get it
ChillerDragon: ssh had a "anyone can log in as root" vulnerability yesterday. patch your server!
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wb heinrich
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thanks
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 08:33:47Z
holy moly. does debian even have patches for that?
Replying to @heinrich5991 ChillerDragon: ssh had a "anyone can log in as root" vulnerability yeste…
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 08:36:03Z
yes
Replying to chillerdragon holy moly. does debian even have patches for that?
08:36
I already applied them yesterday
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 08:37:13Z
OpenSSH_9.2p1 Debian-2+deb12u3, OpenSSL 3.0.13 30 Jan 2024
08:37
LGTM
08:37
is systemctl restart sshd enough?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 08:37:56Z
ssh -v localhost
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 08:38:57Z
smart
08:39
ye lgtm
08:39
the 3 in the end is the fix i assume
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 08:39:20Z
yeah
08:39
well it sounds like they just disabled some code xd
08:39
probably better to update as soon as they apply the real patch
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 08:40:32Z
sounds good to me
08:41
08:41
my laptop is vulnerable
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My servers ssh version is before the regresshion, so it's safe without upgrading 😄
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"safe"
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 08:58:20Z
xxxxxxxxD
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 09:05:41Z
oh boi 4k players online right now
09:06
i basically didnt open my client this year didnt know the game is still very much alive
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heinrich5991
"safe"
safe from this one specific critical bug, to be more exact 😄
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i just realize
09:15
our company really like pushing releases when i'm not at work
09:15
maybe whenever I'm at work thing are always not ready
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@heinrich5991 when you get around to looking at atleast the teehistorian files local to that server, I can finally consider upgrading and rebooting that server
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local to what server? learath2.info?
09:16
it has full disk encryption with a handrolled initramfs script, there is a chance that if I upgrade it and something goes wrong I might lose all the data on it 😄
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the script I sent you was buggy, right?
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TsFreddie
our company really like pushing releases when i'm not at work
u didn't quit yet?
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I updated my server, but sshd doesn't restart anymore. I started sshd manually again. but I'm also scared of rebooting ^^ @Learath2
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heinrich5991
the script I sent you was buggy, right?
Yes, I think I gave you a full log. It crashes for some reason and dumps just a list of all the files
09:48
It works just fine in a smaller folder though
09:51
ah thanks
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quality software
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Learath2
ah thanks
name and shame pls
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heinrich5991
name and shame pls
Grafana Loki
👍 1
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22b051c Add winter_main_0.7 mapres - ChillerDragon 83abf98 Merge pull request #8546 from ChillerDragon/pr_07_winter - def-
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Why Ukrainian Novice is passworded 🙁
Replying to @heinrich5991 image.png
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GitHub
Click to see attachment 🖼️
@heinrich5991 it seems the double message doesn't happen anymore
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 10:46:49Z
just the beta server
Replying to egyt Why Ukrainian Novice is passworded 🙁
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Just unhardcode it, what's the problem
Replying to @Ryozuki 64 is like hardcoded everywhere
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egyt
Why Ukrainian Novice is passworded 🙁
I don't see it, is it?
10:54
I wanna host a trashmap server in usa
troll 1
10:55
gerdoe u the troll
10:55
greenthing
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i thought timakro hosts them (edited)
10:56
ddnet service tho
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i like how youtube recommends me to watch videos i have already watched
10:57
(trance dj mixes)
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wanna listen one
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How long is it
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quite a short
10:59
half an hour
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u can send it and I'll listen tomorrow
11:00
it's past my bedtime
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128p in ddnet SUI (edited)
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I'll fork the DDNet client and remove EVERYTHING /hj
Replying to @Learath2 Anyway, do it however you like for your personal project. I definitely w…
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@fokkonaut Crashed: https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/pull/8542#issuecomment-2202783530 I'll disable votes for now
Hey, this Pull Request will add support for 128 (n) clients at the same time. Good for t0 maps, Multeasy, modders, etc. It's based on my implementation in F-DDrace, where it works pretty flawle...
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Ewan
/hj?
Handjob obviously
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Good thing I don't use ssh
Replying to chillerdragon image.png
11:15
half-joking
Replying to @Ewan /hj?
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its me about to steal components from client side code into server side
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zhn
its me about to steal components from client side code into server side
Me Reading your commits pepeW monkaStop poggers2 pepe_holy justatest MonkaS pepe_ew92 kek gigachad
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deen
@fokkonaut Crashed: https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/pull/8542#issuecomment-2202783530 I'll disable votes for now
Ok, voting can happen yea
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I think masterserver needs to allow larger json @heinrich5991 ? 2024-07-02 14:00:02 E register/6/ipv4: error response from master: 400: Request body deserialize error: EOF while parsing a value at line 1 column 16383
12:07
Happened with ~110 players online
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110 again right now
12:08
and it works nice
12:09
server disappeared
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Found it, fixed in the PR
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from list only
12:09
Oh, cool
12:09
ty!
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Please fix the voting crash though, it seems to happen with a 0.7 player because of the playermapping
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Yes, on it
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@deen If u want u can set the mapupdaterate to 5, will be quicker to update the map
12:23
but i think for performance it can stay at 15
12:23
dunno
12:23
or 10, whatv
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 12:32:24Z
why does it even have a update rate?
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cuz why would you run it every tick
12:33
useless
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 12:33:21Z
why doesnt it update based on e.g. player movement
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why dont u make ur own xd
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 12:33:49Z
i have my own
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is it based on e.g. player movement
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 12:34:41Z
let's see, havent read that code in ~6 years
12:34
then probably not
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ChillerDragon: to find out which license to use, where did you copy the code from? probably teeworlds 0.7?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 12:38:27Z
seems it simply checked the player distance on the fly
12:38
was enough for 256 players on a cheap vps
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so u have ddnet code
12:39
xd
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 12:39:16Z
it was for fng vanilla based
12:42
this would be even better
12:42
could directly also be used to solve the O(n²) problem
12:42
without breaking physics
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rust is so ugly
12:43
kek
12:43
c++ ftw
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 12:43:37Z
i guess porting 165 lines of rust code to cpp isnt the world
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HashMap, LinkedHashMap, Pool
not trivial though, I'd say
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 12:45:09Z
sure, pool is just to save heap allocs, would also work fine with heap allocs or stack allocations (esp. if max. number of clients are known at compile time)
12:45
linkedhashmap, i dunno why i used that xd
12:46
maybe at some points i was iterating over the entries
12:46
but doesnt look like i still do that
12:48
and for ddnet physics it would make sense to use a btreeset instead of hashset to keep the ID order correct
12:48
(which is only interesting when to emulate the for i < MAX_CLIENTS loops in the gamecore)
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How does a hashset solve the O(n^2) issue? Do you use a position hash that hashes nearby people in the same bucket?
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ChillerDragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:03:30Z
yea 0.7 I think and a bit of huffman-py and TeeAI xd
Replying to @heinrich5991 ChillerDragon: to find out which license to use, where did you copy the …
13:03
And then what? I just copy the license?
13:04
Huffman-py is also bsd and TeeAi is gpl
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:05:17Z
basically: i calculate the tile of the tee (a tee is almost 1 tile, so that fits quite nice) and add its id to a hashset later in character core: i get all ids in a certain radius (so basically all tiles in that radius)
Replying to @Learath2 How does a hashset solve the O(n^2) issue? Do you use a position hash th…
13:05
the "real" radius calculation is still done
13:05
just for fewer entries
13:05
since the tile based radius check ofc isnt perfect
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ChillerDragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:06:03Z
@heinrich5991 I also took the packer code 1:1
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whats the problem here?
13:06
im ootl
13:06
when quadtrees?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:06:31Z
i think that approach is better
Replying to @Ryozuki when quadtrees?
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ChillerDragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:06:32Z
And swarfy also looked at the TeeAI code for his type script Huffman
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Jupstar ✪
basically: i calculate the tile of the tee (a tee is almost 1 tile, so that fits quite nice) and add its id to a hashset later in character core: i get all ids in a certain radius (so basically all tiles in that radius)
Ah the grid approach, where does a hashmap come in?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:06:38Z
bcs updating the quadtree isnt really cheap
13:06
simply the tile index
Replying to @Learath2 Ah the grid approach, where does a hashmap come in?
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ChillerDragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:07:57Z
@heinrich5991 you just wanna merge licenses together or what? At which point is a rewrite enough to decouple the license? What license is teeworlds even? Isn’t that bsd like too? How would I give proper credit?
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Ah to get what character is on the tile
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:08:47Z
yeah
13:08
in "normal" case this is very fast, since tees usually dont stack
13:09
in worst case it's as bad as the current O(n²) plus the overhead of this idea
13:09
so in practice even a bit worse
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ChillerDragon
@heinrich5991 you just wanna merge licenses together or what? At which point is a rewrite enough to decouple the license? What license is teeworlds even? Isn’t that bsd like too? How would I give proper credit?
ChillerDragon: teeworlds has zlib license. I just used that instead of your bsd license, because you wanted a simple solution. you're allowed to look at other code, preferably only to figure out how it works. copying the code requires you to stay with the original license (or a compatible one) though. you could e.g. create a new implementation by just looking at docs, e.g. libtw2 docs (this is one reason I created them)
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is TeeAi mine?
13:11
gpl pog
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(btw you are right, a grid works much better than a quadtree with the amount of moving things we have)
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:11:46Z
Yes you said assume it’s gpl
Replying to @Ryozuki is TeeAi mine?
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:11:53Z
It has no license file
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ill add the license
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:12:12Z
I guess I need this license in a bunch repos too now
Replying to @heinrich5991 ChillerDragon: teeworlds has zlib license. I just used that instead of y…
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:12:46Z
Took me two days to rewrite Huffman-py to get rid of gpl in twnet_parser
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:13:01Z
And now heino says I’m violating licenses again -.-
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is twnet_parser closed source
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no
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:13:43Z
No but I want it to be bsd
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Clean-room design (also known as the Chinese wall technique) is the method of copying a design by reverse engineering and then recreating it without infringing any of the copyrights associated with the original design. Clean-room design is useful as a defense against copyright infringement because it relies on independent creation. However, beca...
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:13:51Z
It’s on Gitlab
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woops, wrong link, but also good
13:13
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why not use gpl
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:14:29Z
I want freedom for my users
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:14:29Z
GPL is good for users, bad for devs
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:14:41Z
Freedom includes closed source and mixing with other licensed code
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chillerdragon
I want freedom for my users
thats what gpl does best for users
13:15
closed source removes freedom for users tho
13:15
MIT/X license, BSD licenses (in the three-clause and two-clause forms, though not the original four-clause form), MPL 2.0, and LGPL, are GPL-compatible.
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:16:23Z
0BSD, best for devs, good for users, but can be bad if used in closed source
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:16:40Z
The users of a network protocol library might want to build a closed source project. If they can not do it because it’s gpl they are less free.
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only best for devs wanting to create closed-source projects
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Ryozuki
closed source removes freedom for users tho
He wants freedom for HIS users, not his users users 😄
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for devs wanting to create open-source software, gpl can be better
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:17:11Z
they have to know about limitations of GPL
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but if you want to support devs wanting to create closed-source projects, then gpl is indeed incompatible with it
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:17:15Z
that alone makes it worse
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:17:21Z
I like code with no strings attached. Free to copy paste, edit. No obligations what so ever. (edited)
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then why do you use the bsd license?
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i guess we value different things
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that requires some things
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:17:51Z
I thought that’s the one xd
Replying to @heinrich5991 then why do you use the bsd license?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:17:51Z
chiller use 0BSD
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Finally something I kinda agree with chillerdragon on
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use C0
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Learath2
Finally something I kinda agree with chillerdragon on
Lmao
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:18:13Z
CC0 sucks bcs europe rights xd
13:18
0BSD is my new love
13:18
xd
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agpl is my love
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:18:33Z
originally approved under the name of Free Public License 1.0.0., Sep 26, 2018 asked to rename, approved the renomination on Fall Face to face meeting, 2018 https://opensource.org/meeting-minutes/minutes2018fallf2f/
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also coolest logo
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:18:39Z
also an accepted open source license
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Jupstar ✪
CC0 sucks bcs europe rights xd
reference? I don't think so
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CC0 is compatible with europe's right. are you referring to "public domain" maybe?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:19:01Z
urheberrecht (edited)
Replying to @heinrich5991 reference? I don't think so
13:19
you cannot really do public domain
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:19:15Z
0BSD lgtm might use it in the future
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heinrich5991
that requires some things
bsd 3 clause is do whatever you want but keep this notice, and don't use my name as marketing ALSO YOU CANT SUE ME IF THIS DESTROYS THE WORLD
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CC0 is not public domain fully but its like public domain
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chillerdragon
Freedom includes closed source and mixing with other licensed code
use llvm license
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Ryozuki
ew
the llvm dev live reaction:
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the only thing i hate about llvm is the license and that they provide a C api on usage effort only
13:19
xd
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Learath2
bsd 3 clause is do whatever you want but keep this notice, and don't use my name as marketing ALSO YOU CANT SUE ME IF THIS DESTROYS THE WORLD
Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer. Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the documentation and/or other materials provided with the distribution.
13:20
it must also go into the binary and you cannot remove attribution
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llvm's license actually the only thing why it got so popular
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"keep this notice"
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already way worse than teeworlds' zlib license
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we could have many gcc based compilers if not gpl
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0BSD or Apache license for me
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zhn
llvm's license actually the only thing why it got so popular
well it got popular because apple uses it
13:20
its funded by apple too
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Ryozuki
well it got popular because apple uses it
and because gpl was anti-extensions
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also because the code is more readable
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:20:48Z
No way you tought of licenses while creating docs xd
Replying to @heinrich5991 ChillerDragon: teeworlds has zlib license. I just used that instead of y…
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and modular
13:20
than gcc
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i mean its more popular than you think
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heinrich5991
and because gpl was anti-extensions
gcc u mean
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yes, gcc
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chillerdragon
No way you tought of licenses while creating docs xd
I did. I wanted libtw2 to be a clean-room implementation
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llvm is rly popular yes
13:21
its a good piece of software
13:21
compiler wise its the epitome of research imho
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like you can't make proprietary software if u set gpl as license
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specially MLIR
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llvm would die at its start
13:21
or someone would remake it
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zhn
llvm would die at its start
i dont think its true
13:21
gcc is gpl and its widely used
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heinrich5991
already way worse than teeworlds' zlib license
"way worse" is very subjective, the zlib license only allows binary distributions to not include the notice, that's all that's extra
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gcc is gpl but u can compile propietary software btw
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i don't really see many gcc extensions made by companies
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the compiled stuff has nothing to do with gcc
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im talking about tooling, not about compiling foreign programs
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nvcc uses gcc
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Learath2
"way worse" is very subjective, the zlib license only allows binary distributions to not include the notice, that's all that's extra
nothing subjective here. chillerdragon said he wanted the least restrictions for users. I'm not sure what you're talking about
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intel's compiler is moving to llvm
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cuz intel suxs
13:23
ofc companies will prefer llvm now
13:23
but u can get success with gpl
13:23
blender is GPL
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blender is not llvm xd
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heinrich5991
nothing subjective here. chillerdragon said he wanted the least restrictions for users. I'm not sure what you're talking about
The "way" is what makes it subjective. It is worse, exactly 1 clause worse
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im talking about llvm and only llvm compilant tools
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that wasnt the point
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fair. then let's say "it's obviously worse" (edited)
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did i say gpl kills every software it sticks to
13:24
i said llvm would die if used gpl
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llvm license allowed stuff like nvvm to be born
13:24
nvvm is propietary blegh
13:24
Reference guide to the NVVM compiler IR (intermediate representation) based on the LLVM IR.
13:24
i like amd tends to be more open
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zhn
we could have many gcc based compilers if not gpl
I kinda doubt this. Have you ever touched the gcc codebase?
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:25:58Z
Imagine there was some bullshiting going on about antibot being closed source because teeworlds was super infectious lgpl++ which if linked against a struct of same shape statically or dynamically or even just through a reverse proxy forces you to publish source code as rom disk on request within 24 working days
Replying to @heinrich5991 for devs wanting to create open-source software, gpl can be better
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Learath2
I kinda doubt this. Have you ever touched the gcc codebase?
ye and it stinks i know
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llvm is easier to contribute and use thats the simple reason
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I think only 10 people on earth would be able to do anything with that codebase, in comparison llvm is very pretty 😄
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and its made to be used for other stuff than C based langs
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Learath2
I think only 10 people on earth would be able to do anything with that codebase, in comparison llvm is very pretty 😄
could be prettier though
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zhn
could be prettier though
i think the effort can be commended
13:27
do u know how big llvm code is
13:27
its insane
13:27
thats why im saying that xd
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and they do various techniques so the code isnt that big
13:27
like having special file formats to describe CPUs
13:27
and tablegen
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i think somebody currently makes llvm like clearer source behind the curtains
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chillerdragon
0BSD lgtm might use it in the future
0bsd is the no clout version of bsd licenses. I don't think there is any point allowing people to use my code without so much as a credit, but that's just me
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that uses llvm ir
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Someone should make a hosting aware version of bsd like agpl is to gpl
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:30:26Z
I appreciate credit. But if it’s legally forced it’s cringe. I prefer credit on a nice to have basis. Crediting is imo worth more and more fun to receive and give if it’s not something you MUST do.
Replying to @Learath2 0bsd is the no clout version of bsd licenses. I don't think there is any…
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ok chiller
13:32
all software you made
13:32
is made by me
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then 0bsd/cc0 are what you want
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:32:43Z
So it’s gpl?
Replying to @Ryozuki is made by me
13:32
xD
13:32
u require no attribution
13:32
so all you made
13:32
is made by me
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:33:03Z
All software you make is gpl
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and ill make a web
13:33
saying its made by me
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:33:18Z
If you claim mine is yours will it become gpl?
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not technically true
13:33
can u imagine it?
13:33
maybe i can appropiate ur software
13:33
claim its mine
13:33
and make it gpl
13:33
if u want to give all rights then u should give me the right to relicense
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:34:09Z
Im scared of being unable to access my own because I went to permissive xd
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i take ur all rights given software and make it my own, any changes and make it agpl
13:34
why u scared, u wanted all freedom
13:34
u dont want to take away my freedom right? xd
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:35:01Z
I would also like to have the freedom to use my own code however I want and claim it’s mine xd
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I actually don't know what happens if you take 0bsd/cc0/mit0 licensed code and release it under a more restrictive license
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you can always take any piece of open-source software (minimal restrictions apply) and turn it agpl for modifications
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you are certainly allowed to do so, but idk what happens then 😄
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The paradox of tolerance states that if a society's practice of tolerance is inclusive of the intolerant, intolerance will ultimately dominate, eliminating the tolerant and the practice of tolerance with them. Karl Popper describes the paradox as arising from the fact that, in order to maintain a tolerant society, the society must retain the rig...
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Learath2
I actually don't know what happens if you take 0bsd/cc0/mit0 licensed code and release it under a more restrictive license
then it's just released under both licenses
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:35:42Z
Well that’s why I just try not to think to hard about it. Xd
Replying to @Ryozuki u dont want to take away my freedom right? xd
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my freedom is to make stuff agpl TrollDespair
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heinrich5991
then it's just released under both licenses
How do I prove that my 0bsd copy of it is actually released before the agpl version and that I didn't steal the agpl version?
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also i would always use a license that protects from patent trolls
13:36
aplg and apache do it iirc
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Learath2
How do I prove that my 0bsd copy of it is actually released before the agpl version and that I didn't steal the agpl version?
the same way you prove that something is your work and not someone elses
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I see
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:42:11Z
and who defines where tolerance starts and ends?
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Deciding whether to tolerate an item involves a balancing of reasons, for example when we weigh the reasons for rejecting an idea we find problematic against the benefit of accepting it in the name of social harmony, and it is in this balancing of reasons that the paradox of tolerance arises.[9] Most formulations of tolerance assert that tolerance is a reciprocal act, and the intolerant need not be tolerated. This necessitates drawing a limit between the tolerant and intolerant in every implementation of tolerance, which suggests that any act of tolerance requires an act of intolerance.
13:43
thats the paradox jupstar
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:44:16Z
sure, but i bet you and me are also intollerant. Most ppl seem to be ok with closed source software, we defs arent
13:44
so should we be excluded? xd
13:44
ill go live in a cave
13:44
monk
13:44
and bald
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:44:53Z
epyc
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white jupeyy < purple jupeyy
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:46:54Z
yeah sry, i have no discord access here
13:46
gotta live with that xd
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Ryozuki
ill go live in a cave
Can i Join? I Take Care of fishies
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:48:40Z
chillerdragon: which color do i have for u xd
13:48
u have orange for me
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:50:23Z
I use two chat apps atm Which ever has the better order of chat messages and best success rate at displaying message content
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:50:40Z
you have 24 matrix sessions xDD
13:51
"FluffyChat ios"
13:51
apple nobo
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:51:26Z
13:51
Yes
13:51
Because I am too lazy to debug irc
13:51
And possibly too tipsy to open laptop anyways
13:52
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Ewan
On phone atm but here's the gist I have a flake that I wanna use as my system config https://github.com/ewancg/shit
Did you fix this already? :O
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:52:12Z
Classic jupsti color
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:52:35Z
nice i have ddnet admin color
13:53
chillerdragon: i am surprised you dont use the IRC layout xd
13:54
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:54:37Z
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ChillerDragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:54:46Z
I prefer discord layout
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:55:18Z
i use chat bubbles, then i at least dont read me own messages xdd
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ChillerDragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:55:55Z
If you don’t agree with the defaults you use the wrong software
Replying to Jupstar ✪ chillerdragon: i am surprised you dont use the IRC layout xd
13:55
Change my mind
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:56:21Z
it's no secret i find element.io shit xD
13:56
bloated, slow too many bugs
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Ewan
ewan@machine ~/shit (main)> nixos-rebuild --flake ./nixos#machine build building the system configuration... error: … while calling the 'head' builtin at /nix/store/g83ji892byw4wd81rmb14v69yrhq408s-source/lib/attrsets.nix:1575:11: 1574| || pred here (elemAt values 1) (head values) then 1575| head values | ^ 1576| else … while evaluating the attribute 'value' at /nix/store/g83ji892byw4wd81rmb14v69yrhq408s-source/lib/modules.nix:809:9: 808| in warnDeprecation opt // 809| { value = builtins.addErrorContext "while evaluating the option `${showOption loc}':" value; | ^ 810| inherit (res.defsFinal') highestPrio; (stack trace truncated; use '--show-trace' to show the full trace) error: getting status of '/nix/store/pz24qq8rhnc918bg0n31xpli9fs3vz82-source/.config': No such file or directory
my shit. Contribute to ewancg/shit development by creating an account on GitHub.
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ChillerDragon BOT 2024-07-02 13:56:56Z
Matrix is the worst
13:57
I will fix the irc connection this month!
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 13:57:37Z
matrix is too complex and can almost not be changed
13:57
but the idea is cool
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:00:34Z
Nothing can compete with the one and only chat platform that has a kog logo glitching behind messages
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 14:00:59Z
forum.qshar.com?
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:01:02Z
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 14:01:13Z
lmao
Replying to chillerdragon ima_01d8a23.png
14:01
nice
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:01:18Z
Omg good times
Replying to Jupstar ✪ forum.qshar.com?
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chillerdragon can you tell me my password on ur chat justatest
14:01
i forgor
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:01:46Z
vulkanGaming69
14:01
I think
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 14:02:02Z
wow
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:02:09Z
Opsi
14:02
But it’s read only
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While working on #8542 I noticed that the max clients handling is inconsistent. It uses MAX_CLIENTS and CNetServer::MaxClients() in different places. Setting the sv_max_clients from rcon will not prevent new players from joining if the initial sv_max_clients was higher, since CNetServer::m_MaxClients isn't updated. Same the other way around, if your initial sv_max_clients is lower than the one you're trying to set from rcon, players will be able to join the server, but not the enter the game.
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:02:42Z
Cuz irc send bug since 2 days
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 14:02:49Z
i hope you are aware i used that pw in other places too
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:03:01Z
lol
14:03
I use a different pw for my account
14:03
vulkanGaming69 is guest password
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 14:04:11Z
it was hot, spicy and porn (edited)
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when add forgot password button
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 14:04:22Z
that was the most secure pw ever
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:04:32Z
Uff
Replying to @MilkeeyCat when add forgot password button
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 14:04:44Z
when add ssh login support
14:04
key auth
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when add voice channels
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:05:11Z
Eeeee
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 14:05:15Z
i am interested in 120fps livestreaming
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:06:18Z
Omg such shit talking again xd I rq
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 14:06:34Z
same, weather is getting better
14:06
cya
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chillerdragon BOT 2024-07-02 14:08:35Z
Jopsti weather reveal (edited)
14:09
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chillerdragon
Click to see attachment 🖼️
dark
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chillerdragon
Click to see attachment 🖼️
Is that this auto generated dark theme ?????
14:22
🤩
14:22
@Patiga good job on the map lib looks crisp
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i see you are doing 128 player server
14:34
what makes it difficult to raise size from 64?
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fokkonaut
@Patiga good job on the map lib looks crisp
thx! :)
14:35
Python or Rust?
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Bors Matyas
what makes it difficult to raise size from 64?
Lots of statically sized stuff and the fact that the client only supports 64 tees
14:36
So lots of code needs to be modified to change mask sizes and array sizes + there is a complex layer that is needed to decide which 64 tees will get sent to each player
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wow thx
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i am once again compiling llvm
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how about arbitrary player count support?
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Would be even better, but harder to support properly, especially if you want to keep stuff close by in the stack
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Maybe compile time configurable
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Ryozuki
i am once again compiling llvm
is this a way for you to stress-test your pc every month? kek
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timakro
Maybe compile time configurable
A little less hard to support properly. Ideally it would only be changing MAX_CLIENTS. I think eeeee implemented this once upon a time for ddwar but it's been so long I'm pretty sure the implementation is lost to time
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https://rust-lang.github.io/rust-clippy/master/index.html#/incorrect_partial_ord_impl_on_ord_type Why is this bad? If both PartialOrd and Ord are implemented, they must agree. This is commonly done by wrapping the result of cmp in Some for partial_cmp. Not doing this may silently introduce an error upon refactoring.

Checklist

  • [ ] Tested the change ingame
  • [ ] Provided screenshots if it is a visual change
  • [ ] Tested in combination with possibly related configuration optio...
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Learath2
A little less hard to support properly. Ideally it would only be changing MAX_CLIENTS. I think eeeee implemented this once upon a time for ddwar but it's been so long I'm pretty sure the implementation is lost to time
clientside ddwar ?
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fokkonaut
clientside ddwar ?
No, the clientside is the code that ddrace inherited later, ddrace64. Iirc ddraceN mapped down to 64
15:47
well, the serverside implementation of mine works for n tees
15:48
supporting more than 64 players is not a problem on the server side. Just the player mapping is required. Client needs more work, of course. But I am also hoping that there are no fixed 64 arrays in the server
15:49
in F-DDrace all of them have been set to hold MAX_CLIENTS
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Fixes the following warning
warning: some crates are on edition 2021 which defaults to resolver = "2", but virtual workspaces default to resolver = "1"
note: to keep the current resolver, specify workspace.resolver = "1" in the workspace root’s manifest note: to use the edition 2021 resolver, specify workspace.resolver = "2" in the workspace root’s manifest

Checklist

  • [ ] Tested the change ingame
  • [ ] Provided screenshots if it is a visual change
  • [ ] Tested in combinatio...
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I seem to have lost some irclogs somewhere 😦
crythumbsup 2
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Ok I was curious but it seems the ddwar source is indeed lost to time, unless @heinrich5991 managed to snag a copy for his archive. Sadge
16:01
I wanted to check how the client mapping was done, I remember it being pretty simple and pretty decent
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Ok, I found it again, it wasn't as I remembered. We did have client support and we just crashed clients that couldn't handle more than 16 tees. @Jupstar ✪ would be proud
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on purpose? like CrashThisClient(...)? xd
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 16:20:55Z
@Jupstar ✪: is proud
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zhn
on purpose? like CrashThisClient(...)? xd
No. We'd just send a snap with more than 16 clients and it'd just die
16:24
I think then we added an rcon command specifically stating >16 support crashmeplx
16:24
I don't remember what we did to clients that didn't send it though
16:25
I'm using "we" rather loosely there btw. fstd and eeeee were doing the work and they graciously let me watch and pretend I'm being useful
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you were just collecting mana (edited)
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I was absorbing C/C++
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zhn
you were just collecting mana (edited)
don't be so critical about yourself xd
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I'm talking about like 13 years ago. I was truly a burden to everyone around. So glad they still let me do stuff even if it meant they had to fix it up afterwards 😄
16:31
Any ideas why it can't find SDL2 and Freetype?
16:32
Is it a cmake error or a build.yaml error?
16:36
https://github.com/fokkonaut/F-Client/blob/0b0a97f400f3e6a11348151e5197f8c264e0fd96/CMakeLists.txt#L101-L114 Could it be that this Python3_EXECUTABLE is wrong? It used to say PYTHON_EXECUTABLE before I switched
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 16:36:41Z
-1 years?
Replying to @Learath2 I'm talking about like 13 years ago. I was truly a burden to everyone ar…
16:36
wow
16:36
not bad
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Jupstar ✪
-1 years?
Na, I was 5 on my other personality. The one you are talking about wasn't born yet
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lerato
16:39
need ur help
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Can't. I'm going shopping, then cooking, then eating
🍻 1
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Havefun xd
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I don't understand. Locally it uses the bundled version, why can't it on the CI?
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91ddec0 fix resolver version warning for workspaces in rust2 - edg-l 9db780e Merge pull request #8549 from edg-l/fix_rust_workspace_resolver - heinrich5991
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fokkonaut
I don't understand. Locally it uses the bundled version, why can't it on the CI?
Traceback (most recent call last): File "D:\a\F-Client\F-Client\scripts\download.py", line 2, in <module> from distutils.dir_util import copy_tree ModuleNotFoundError: No module named 'distutils'
17:02
that looks relevant
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Where did you find that-?
17:03
ahj
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in the log you posted
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I see
17:03
What even is that? (edited)
17:04
what and why The GitHub actions macOS CI pipeline is failing on this step if python 3.12 is used. (which is not the case on current master but at some point it would be nice to update to this or a ...
17:08
thanks so much
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mportError: cannot import name 'copy_tree' from 'twlib' (D:\a\F-Client\F-Client\scripts\twlib.py)
17:17
omg
17:18
got it
17:23
yay
17:23
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in 128 player map selecting player name with tab doesnt work for new players
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^
Replying to Jupstar ✪ GPL is good for users, bad for devs
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IMO it's only bad for devs who want to produce closed-source software
17:48
or those that want to support devs who want to produce closed-source software
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its bad when you want to monetize your project
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MIT-0 FTW
Replying to Jupstar ✪ 0BSD is my new love
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zhn
its bad when you want to monetize your project
only if you don't want to share the source ^^
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 17:52:02Z
mostly yes, but it's also about younger devs that aren't aware so much about licenses additionally in theory you could not even test some stuff with friends without always providing source
Replying to @heinrich5991 IMO it's only bad for devs who want to produce closed-source software
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Jupstar ✪
mostly yes, but it's also about younger devs that aren't aware so much about licenses additionally in theory you could not even test some stuff with friends without always providing source
you only have to provide the source if someone is asking
17:53
if your friends aren't asking, you don't have to provide the source
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 17:53:05Z
also you cannot use GPL in permissive licenses
Replying to @heinrich5991 you only have to provide the source if someone is asking
17:53
so you have to be careful there too
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I love how some companies will send it to you on floppies in mail just to be vein
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No, "YOU CANT SUE ME IF THIS DESTROYS THE WORLD" is part of BSD 3-Clause No Nuclear Warranty
Replying to @Learath2 bsd 3 clause is do whatever you want but keep this notice, and don't use…
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Jupstar ✪
also you cannot use GPL in permissive licenses
not sure what this means. you can license your own code however you like. you might need to also allow people to use your code under the GPL
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GPLs biggest issue is it's poisonous incompatible nature. It basically forces all derivatives to be gpl too
17:54
So any gpl code is instantly a no-go for someone wanting to release under something less restrictive
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 17:54:54Z
yes if i depend on GPL libraries my code will need to use GPL too
Replying to @heinrich5991 not sure what this means. you can license your own code however you like…
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but you can still also release your code under less restrictive licenses
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 17:55:12Z
can you quote that in the GPL license?
Replying to @heinrich5991 you only have to provide the source if someone is asking
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Our General Public Licenses are designed to make sure that you have the freedom to distribute copies of free software (and charge for them if you wish), that you receive source code or can get it if you want it, that you can change the software or use pieces of it in new free programs, and that you know you can do these things.
17:56
(from the preamble)
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 17:56:40Z
so if i create a closed source program using GPL code and die, what then?
Replying to @heinrich5991
Our General Public Licenses are designed to make sure that you have th…
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then you can't provide the source code anymore?
17:57
so if you promise something and die, what then?
17:57
it doesn't happen anymore
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 17:59:02Z
i am not sure about that anyway
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Learath2
So any gpl code is instantly a no-go for someone wanting to release under something less restrictive
this hinges on the fact that there's something wrong with the GPL. if you agree with all of GPL's restrictions, there's no problem that it "forces itself" onto all derivatives. note that even BSD licenses "forces" attribution on all derivatives
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 17:59:10Z
the FAQ for AGPL for example says: "A company is running a modified version of a program licensed under the GNU Affero GPL (AGPL) on a web site. Does the AGPL say they must release their modified sources? (#UnreleasedModsAGPL) The GNU Affero GPL requires that modified versions of the software offer all users interacting with it over a computer network an opportunity to receive the source."
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an opportunity to receive the source.
17:59
this says the same. you have to provide it if someone asks
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:00:23Z
well you "asking" sounds like i open a chat and ask him
18:00
i doubt that is meant by that
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I'm pretty sure that's okay
18:00
otherwise there would be more concrete provisions
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:00:47Z
ok i provide you this... just give me 100 years
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I'm sure the judge will grant you a reasonable time frame for this, which 100 years is not
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:01:22Z
see
18:01
and now you understand why it's not dev friendly
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no?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:01:50Z
suddenly a dev needs to know about what judges think
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no?
18:02
just apply common sense
18:02
"ability to receive the program"
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I think it would be useful to add CI for the Android build, so we notice when it breaks in the future. It would also allow building and uploading the APK as an artifact. This would require adding the precompiled libraries for Android to https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet-libs, as building the libraries would take too long to do it every time in the CI. The downside would be that this would increase the size of the ddnet-libs repository from around 228 MiB to around 400 MiB. Another importan...
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:02:14Z
k
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if someone asks, give it to them
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:02:41Z
GPL is really cool and it's super easy to understand, every dev understands what it stands for. really great
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probably not how I'd word it
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I am probably too late, but Ryozuki is just trying to scare you. AFAIK claiming other's work as your own is illegal even if the work is in public domain. I am not a lawyer, of course.
Replying to chillerdragon Im scared of being unable to access my own because I went to permissive …
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egyt
I am probably too late, but Ryozuki is just trying to scare you. AFAIK claiming other's work as your own is illegal even if the work is in public domain. I am not a lawyer, of course.
hmmmmmmm. got any source for that?
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Unless it is incompatible with AGPL :P
Replying to @heinrich5991 you can always take any piece of open-source software (minimal restricti…
18:08
Ukrainian law, but I am almost sure that it is quite the same in other European countries (iirc chillerdragon is in Germany, right?)
Replying to @heinrich5991 hmmmmmmm. got any source for that?
18:10
At least I know that by European law you MUST give attribution, as it is a moral right which doesn't expire
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I'd like to see a citation on that
18:11
if that is/were the case, then CC0 would not work in europe
18:12
the wikipedia article doesn't mention conflicts with european law, at least
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heinrich5991
only if you don't want to share the source ^^
ye imagine if you ended up making specific compiler optimizations for your compiler that makes code running faster ~5% on your hardware for each but it can be used on another hw and give ~2% improvements
18:13
no one will buy your hardware if its better only because of software improvements that you share with others in this worlds
18:13
world*
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On Wikimedia Commons I saw something like "I put this work into the public domain, but if it is not possible in your country, then I allow you to use it to the maximum extent permitted by the law" (edited)
Replying to @heinrich5991 if that is/were the case, then CC0 would not work in europe
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egyt
On Wikimedia Commons I saw something like "I put this work into the public domain, but if it is not possible in your country, then I allow you to use it to the maximum extent permitted by the law" (edited)
"public domain" is not a concept in europe AFAIK, but that doesn't say anything about CC0
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Well, CC0 provides such a workaround for countries with less permissive laws about PD
Replying to @heinrich5991 "public domain" is not a concept in europe AFAIK, but that doesn't say a…
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sooooo. you claimed that I cannot use CC0'ed works without attribution in europe. do you have a source for that?
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Well, I guess no 👀
18:24
Although wait...
18:25
Yeah
18:25
Moral rights are rights of creators of copyrighted works generally recognized in civil law jurisdictions and, to a lesser extent, in some common law jurisdictions. The moral rights include the right of attribution, the right to have a work published anonymously or pseudonymously, and the right to the integrity of the work. The preserving of the ...
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:25:38Z
you should just be careful with releasing CC0 software by your own
18:25
CC0 tries to actively remove your copyright
18:26
CC0 is also currently not a approved open source license
18:27
"CC0 was not explicitly rejected, but the License Review Committee was unable to reach consensus that it should be approved, and Creative Commons eventually withdrew the application. The most serious of the concerns raised had to do with the effects of clause 4(a), which reads: “No … patent rights held by Affirmer are waived, abandoned, surrendered, licensed or otherwise affected by this document.”. While many open source licenses simply do not mention patents, it is exceedingly rare for open source licenses to explicitly disclaim any conveyance of patent rights, and the Committee felt that approving such a license would set a dangerous precedent, and possibly even weaken patent infringement defenses available to users of software released under CC0."
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Because it is mainly meant not for programs :P
Replying to Jupstar ✪ CC0 is also currently not a approved open source license
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:29:10Z
but so or so, all these things are human invented things. laws are and will always be subjective to a certain point
18:29
math is the only good thing. even tho you could say a law is also just complex math, math doesn't judge about itself xdd
18:30
it's just there to be discovered
18:30
egyt: could you accept that you have no free will?
18:30
or do you dislike that concept
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Define "free will"
Replying to Jupstar ✪ egyt: could you accept that you have no free will?
18:32
A nice idea for a video: "Is forced freedom still freedom?"
Replying to @Ryozuki my freedom is to make stuff agpl
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:33:32Z
that you have a will that is not controllable, and thus not (not even in theory) calculatable.
Replying to egyt Define "free will"
18:33
for example arguments for a free will are flaws in math
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Mi ne kompreni vin...
Replying to Jupstar ✪ that you have a will that is not controllable, and thus not (not even in…
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I'm struggling with a cxx.rs problem 😦
18:40
Pin<UniquePtr<T>> should be Unpin
troll 1
18:41
ah, I think I need to update cxx
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excuse me?
Replying to Jupstar ✪ it was hot, spc
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:43:50Z
vulkan is hot gaming is spicy 69 is porn
Replying to egyt excuse me?
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heinrich5991
Pin<UniquePtr<T>> should be Unpin
How? 😄
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:46:17Z
unique ptr is unique xd
Replying to @Learath2 How? 😄
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I should be able to move a pinned pointer around
18:46
Pin just says that I shouldn't be able to move out of the inner pointer
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:46:51Z
so did cxx upgrade fix it?
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yes
18:46
needs cxx 1.0.75
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:47:05Z
epyc
18:47
new is good
18:47
😬
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Ah, I see
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what are the average perf for RUS2 (128p srv) ? also what specs?
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You are saying the pinned pointer should be moveable. Why did I even think you'd say the inner should be unpin 😄
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:53:34Z
@Learath2: r u still learning go?
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I think I know pretty much all there is to know about it now. It's not a very deep language. I'm only missing internals and some reflection magic still escapes me, but that's about it
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I want to be able to call a rust function from go, natively and without cgo. what do I need to do?
18:55
go has some weird calling convention, I can certainly implement that from the rust side
18:55
how do I link it in? do I need to produce go assembly from my rust crate or can I somehow link object files in?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:55:39Z
wow heinrich took that personal xd
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Check out that one blog post I sent a month or so back last we talked. Sadly it's not very easy it seems
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 18:55:52Z
what is your rating [0-10]?
Replying to @Learath2 I think I know pretty much all there is to know about it now. It's not a…
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ah, we already talked about this. sorry, I seem to have forgotten
18:56
I guess what remains in my memory is parts of that conversation
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You can link objects in that part is trivial, you should probably use the stable ABI0 that go has, but the problem is I don't really think there is a way to get go to use that convention when calling out to the linked in function, that's the part you'll need someone with more go knowledge than me for
18:57
Usually you use ABI0 when writing inline assembly in go, so you put an annotation that marks your function as ABI0 then go knows how to call it
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You can link objects in that part is trivial
ah nice
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Learath2
Usually you use ABI0 when writing inline assembly in go, so you put an annotation that marks your function as ABI0 then go knows how to call it
hmm, so I could achieve it with an inline assembly wrapper that simply jumps to the rust function? (edited)
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I think it should be possible somehow
19:01
I'd have to think about it a bit more 😄
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cool. I'll put that on my "future cool big projects list"
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Actually let me give it a quick go without the rust part, see if I can get it to call some assembly properly
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do report back 🙂
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Learath2
Actually let me give it a quick go without the rust part, see if I can get it to call some assembly properly
how is that working out?
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heinrich5991
how is that working out?
Not very fun :D, but I did manage to call some extremely trivial assembly
19:49
So any .syso file you drop into the folder of a go module will get linked in automatically
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what's .syso? .o, but I promise it's from the system?
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heinrich5991
what's .syso? .o, but I promise it's from the system?
.o but just don't mess around with it and link it pls
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that sounds cool 🙂
19:51
can you go from .a to .o?
19:51
I think rust was somehow unable to emit object files
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However, when telling you about ABI0, I kinda forgot that you can't really implement ABI0 without help from the go compiler, it uses pseudo registers
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what are pseudo reigsters?
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So I think your best bet would be to emit go assembler somehow, which can just then be compiled by the go compiler, then you'll have access to the pseudo registers
19:53
e.g. there is a register called SP, it's not a real register, it's just where the compiler decides to put arguments and the assembler will resolve it when assembling go assembler
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ah. and it doesn't always go to the same register?
19:54
so I'd have too emit some go asm shim around my rust code, I guess (if I don't want to emit everything as go asm)
19:55
then I need to hook into the go runtime a little for stack support
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heinrich5991
so I'd have too emit some go asm shim around my rust code, I guess (if I don't want to emit everything as go asm)
Yes, or maybe someone more acquainted with go internals can come up with something better
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I think we might also have to improve the client performance for 128 players. Although this is the debug build, I have 1800 FPS without the 127 debug dummies justatest
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Currently we just hope the client disconnects properly and drop the client after 10 seconds. The client should send back a pong when it received the packet, to let the server know when to drop the client safely after the packet has been arrived. I've tried to implement redirect feature on F-Client, but it seems like some underlying code is broken, which let's 0.7 clients disconnect poorly, and sometimes they just don't tell the server they have exited. This, plus the main reason it was made...
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Robyt3
I think we might also have to improve the client performance for 128 players. Although this is the debug build, I have 1800 FPS without the 127 debug dummies justatest
Yep, in fact, the snaps are heavy on the CPU
20:10
The snap lookups are soo much
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:12:06Z
how much in release? xd
Replying to @Robyt3 I think we might also have to improve the client performance for 128 pla…
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When practicing maps sometimes it's nice to adjust the number of jumps, this can be used to imitate infinite jumps too by settings jumps to a incredibly high value. rcon command is mainly because it seems every practice command has a rcon equivalent so I added that too

Checklist

  • [x] Tested the change ingame
  • [ ] Provided screenshots if it is a visual change
  • [ ] Tested in combination with possibly related configuration options
  • [ ] Written a unit test (especially bas...
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Jupstar ✪
how much in release? xd
around 400 with scoreboard open, 1200 scoreboard close, 2400 without the dummies
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@heinrich5991 you are kinda forced to have atleast a tiny go assembler stub unless you are willing to go all the way to generating your own custom go object files, as it seems they didn't use just normal objects
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:18:52Z
doesn't sound too bad xd
Replying to @Robyt3 around 400 with scoreboard open, 1200 scoreboard close, 2400 without the…
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fokkonaut
The snap lookups are soo much
This can be optimized, we have linear searches everywhere, no?
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I think yes, and yes, it can be improved but we probably have to wait for Roby
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:20:45Z
first i'd check if that is even the problem
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I guess it is a good reason to merge this now 😄
20:20
but yeah, profiling time
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:21:06Z
bcs the physics sound more expensive
20:21
and in scoreboard the text could be cached
20:21
that would defs help
20:22
@Robyt3: can u check if your fps graph is stable at like 500fps?
20:22
bcs if its the snap things it should happen 25 times per second
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do we not look up things from the snap during the tick?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:23:13Z
if they really cost so much FPS that it halves by that, it should be below 1200 FPS during the snaps
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also consider sv_high_bandwidth, some users do that
20:23
(bw)
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:23:28Z
do we?
Replying to @heinrich5991 do we not look up things from the snap during the tick?
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yes, I can find SnapFindItem in the CItems::OnRender function
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:25:30Z
also in players?
Replying to @heinrich5991 yes, I can find `SnapFindItem` in the `CItems::OnRender` function
20:25
i doubt projectiles are fired here
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you can't look it up yourself?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:26:07Z
i think you are doing a great job
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yes, also in CPlayer::OnRender
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:26:37Z
mh k
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Jupstar ✪
@Robyt3: can u check if your fps graph is stable at like 500fps?
I wouldn't call it stable
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:26:53Z
sad that render components even know about network stuff
20:27
@Robyt3: if u have VC installed, they have a pretty nice profiler IMO
20:27
would be worth to fire that up in RelWithDebInfo
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yes, I was in the process of building with VC when you asked for screenshots 😄
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:28:28Z
🫠
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visual c++ (visual studio I assume)
20:34
@heinrich5991 https://go.dev/wiki/GcToolchainTricks here is where I found the trick. https://words.filippo.io/rustgo/ and here is the blog I posted last time. Perhaps save these somewhere along with your "try this one day" note as they are really not easy to find 😄
[русский [https://habrahabr.ru/post/337348/]] Go has good support for calling into assembly, and a lot of the fast cryptographic code in the stdlib is carefully optimized assembly, bringing speedups of over 20 times. However, writing assembly code is hard, reviewing it is possibly harder, and cryptography is unforgiving
20:34
"go" being a common verb can sometimes make it very annoying to google stuff
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:35:53Z
rust being one of the most famous games too xdd
20:35
rust game dev
20:35
rip
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Jupstar ✪
@Robyt3: if u have VC installed, they have a pretty nice profiler IMO
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:39:12Z
mh ok
20:39
physics than get item
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by self time:
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:39:32Z
oh getitemindex
20:39
rip
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:40:49Z
rest in peace
20:41
hashmap time
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Well we should be glad, getitemindex we already know how to optimize
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:42:20Z
but what chiller posted looks like binary search?
20:42
to me this problem looks like hashmap xd
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Oh is that the route vanilla went?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:42:56Z
apparently
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I guess it's better than linear anyway, so merge that first see if it helps, it should "theoretically" reduce it by an entire order of magnitude
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:43:25Z
3 2 1 ryo tells how slow c++ hashmaps are 😬
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Maybe it's too insignificant after to bother with a hashmap
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:44:10Z
well apparently not xD
20:44
if it uses 15% of the whole frame
20:44
ok no idea what ::GetItem requires
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if with binary search it becomes anything close to 1.5% we have other things to look at afterwards, no?
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:45:52Z
sure, but isnt a hashmap kinda easier? xd or is the fear that you also insert all the types that are not used by the client
20:46
well tbh i dont even care
20:46
if the binary search is free to implement why not
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I remember properly getting a hashmap in there requiring much larger changes, that's why I didn't say just go for that directly
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Jupstar ✪ BOT 2024-07-02 20:46:38Z
i see
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I think there is a discussion here between me and heinrich where we kinda sketched out what would be the optimal way to do the snap stuff, then it obviously got lost to time 😄
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Есть руские
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ye in #off-topic
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qwezzz
Есть руские
да
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@Robyt3 if you have VS2023 you should use the flame graph in the profiler it's very useful
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Jupstar ✪
3 2 1 ryo tells how slow c++ hashmaps are 😬
Worst part about std hashmaps is checking for an item that isn't in the set, that operation is like 3-6x slower than other hashmaps.
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1c6e73c Add 25 € funding for ddnet.org by ReD - def-
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@ReD Thanks!
heartw 1
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When did this Unpacker.GetInt() get added? cant find it in blame. Never knew there is another parameter for whether the client requetst the list https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/pull/7764/files#diff-65908fcaf323f624c0a8e584e92664d0d49640bb139729c6e22a14a5b2170c3fR1840
22:56
ez
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Learath2
Handjob obviously
pepeW
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