DDraceNetwork - developer

ChillerDragon

[ddnet/ddnet] Pull request opened: #8409 Mark some character methods const

heinrich5991

[ddnet/ddnet] Pull request closed: #8409 Mark some character methods const

00:49

github-merge-queue[bot]

[ddnet:master] 2 new commits

ffd0da0 Mark some character methods const - ChillerDragon a5ca7c6 Merge pull request #8409 from ChillerDragon/pr_const_char - heinrich5991

@TsFreddie u make games for meta quest right

Ryozuki

@TsFreddie u make games for meta quest right

not directly, but yes

you know what my gf gifted me for my birthday today?

quest 3

ye xd

don't play our game please

xd

07:34

im playing half life alyx (edited)

Freddie made half life?!

im 1 year older today

07:40

closer to 30

1

Ryozuki

im playing half life alyx (edited)

good game

07:52

let me spoil it for you gman is bad lmao

<ChillerDragon> happy bday old man @Ryozuki

Ryozuki

im playing half life alyx (edited)

nice. i still gotta play it. my sister bought it for me last Christmas but i just have a vive and it’s not set up

08:15

ig 2 christmases ago

08:15

fuck

happy birthday btw

Ryozuki

closer to 30

nothing to be proud of xddd but hapπ birthday, may kids best

im 24 now

Ryozuki

im 24 now

don't lie

08:42

u 40

29/05/2000

2

don't do that to me

08:43

u arent so young

Ryozuki

im 24 now

eww

is there a web map editor somewhere?

map viewer only :v

good enuf I guess, where is it

https://ddnet.org/releases/ click on one of the maps (picture) (edited)

Ryozuki

im 24 now

happy bday

, you are now 1 year closer to your expiration date

Cellegen

https://ddnet.org/releases/ click on one of the maps (picture) (edited)

edge crashed, nice

Ryozuki

im 24 now

happy birthday, beers on me owo

Noa

edge crashed, nice

oof

Noa

is there a web map editor somewhere?

i mean this exists but idk more https://github.com/k2d222/twwe

GitHub - k2d222/twwe: Teeworlds collaborative map editor online

Teeworlds collaborative map editor online. Contribute to k2d222/twwe development by creating an account on GitHub.

1

I am currently checking @Patiga s Top 5 maps which have extremly many quads, for duplicates which might be removed. Here are my findings: Mud: 0 duplicates Gummy: 1 duplicates Atomic: 0 duplicates Victory 2:

Most in single layer: 8812
Total quads: 9997
Total duplicates: 4665

Most seem to be duplicated lights in order to make the light effect stronger, so this is by design, questionable design
Effect layer: seems to be an actual bug

run_world_war_zero: 0 duplicates It might make sense to add duplicate detection as a check for map submission

ScReeNy

i mean this exists but idk more https://github.com/k2d222/twwe

omg whoever maintains it still is a legend

09:31

dragging groups ain't a thing, all property values need to be manually assigned on the right... Other than that, it's a fully functional editor

09:33

Oh, now I see chillerdragon is a contributer

09:34

... wait wtf, is this actually an online interactive editor? meaning other users can edit it in real time??

yes

holy fuck, why don't we have that in the client

yet another tool building on patigas bindings

Cellegen

... wait wtf, is this actually an online interactive editor? meaning other users can edit it in real time??

Yeeeh but usually is broken xD

the ui design is kind of similar to TeeUniverse

09:37

was it the inspiration?

Vappy

Yeeeh but usually is broken xD

what exactly breaks if i may ask?

Cellegen

holy fuck, why don't we have that in the client

would be pretty useless

bloat

No nono, not at all, group mapping

asked experienced mappers about it and they said they probably won't use it, simpler to just share the map file

Teero

bloat

huh?

Cellegen

No nono, not at all, group mapping

For the 3 people that use it. Way too much work

^

with that mindset where no risk = no work ain't applied here, it's a loser mentality

you say it would be cool to have it but would you even use it

Cellegen

with that mindset where no risk = no work ain't applied here, it's a loser mentality

Implement it then lmao

no, it's a realistic mentality

@Cellegen if it makes you happy to know dd-pg, which will be ddnet compatible map wise has network support

09:40

tho not as cool as the web thing.. one person hosts, the others can join

Imagine the possibility of mappers coming together, build maps, review maps and even playtest maps using Trashmap implementation or something

Cellegen

Imagine the possibility of mappers coming together, build maps, review maps and even playtest maps using Trashmap implementation or something

as I said, close to nobody will use it

archimede67

as I said, close to nobody will use it

source?

09:41

are you a mapper?

multiple mappers

09:41

i am yes

Jupstar ✪

what exactly breaks if i may ask?

Like the connection of the IP, or the server was misconfigured dont let mapping at the same, but should be fixed now

would you want to explore that idea?

i already thought of it and wanted to implement it

not like, having this exact thing I said, but just the idea of having it?

yes

Well, there is motivation

yeah but it won't happen

Vappy

Like the connection of the IP, or the server was misconfigured dont let mapping at the same, but should be fixed now

ah only config stuff ok.. i thought getting out of sync or smth

Jupstar ✪

ah only config stuff ok.. i thought getting out of sync or smth

Hmmmm yeh, goes pretty fine

I'm kinda sad, that since many people have their own roles in developing this game, nobody would rather take on the quest of making something new, unless you are a veteran like Chillerdragon who experiments stuff like that

1

Cellegen

I'm kinda sad, that since many people have their own roles in developing this game, nobody would rather take on the quest of making something new, unless you are a veteran like Chillerdragon who experiments stuff like that

that's what you think

Can prove you wrong x2

So, still I don't have the authority to say what the devs can or cannot do, but this idea of having contributal interaction inside the editor may be possible and since there is a live example (https://github.com/k2d222/twwe/issues) where the foundation of the idea is there, it's not that difficult to do.

Issues · k2d222/twwe

Teeworlds collaborative map editor online. Contribute to k2d222/twwe development by creating an account on GitHub.

Cellegen

So, still I don't have the authority to say what the devs can or cannot do, but this idea of having contributal interaction inside the editor may be possible and since there is a live example (https://github.com/k2d222/twwe/issues) where the foundation of the idea is there, it's not that difficult to do.

What exactly is not so difficult about this?

it's not that difficult to do™

Visuals can be done, the system is there, so the only thing's missing is API between that server and the client

2

what

it is difficult due to synchronization, on a webserver, like twwe all events are synchronized to the server, if you'd do the same thing in the editor, you would need to synchronize between two clients

09:46

talking about a client integration^

the client only need info, so it's not client specific. syncing info needs to be done in the server

plus twwe uses javascript language which has less restrictions than c++ and is easier to work with regarding sockets and live editing

as said i already have network support

09:47

rust version

Jupstar ✪

rust version

Is it public yet? XD

Teero

Is it public yet? XD

a version from last month is

So the only problem with this idea would be sync issue? xd

09:48

thats the only problem you throw into my head

sync issues, and somebody actually needs to implement it, lastly the code needs to be maintained

i can only say the biggest challenge is to not do out of bounds stuff: https://github.com/Jupeyy/dd-pg/blob/d5009f76e5909be7b8e4be7bda16af1e2118c58b/game/editor/src/action_logic.rs#L524-L1796

dd-pg/game/editor/src/action_logic.rs at d5009f76e5909be7b8e4be7bda...

don't use or read this code. Contribute to Jupeyy/dd-pg development by creating an account on GitHub.

this website ain't maintained, so if someone would implement it, they would contribute to it.

u have to reject actions if they are "outdated" bcs the clients got out of sync

ideally the solution will not use that "website"

So again, sync issues. Syncing can be done in different ways. Priority order or server response system can be done

but also this is simply a huge effort for a thing that almost nobody will use since a big chunk of mappers are solo mappers

I suggest master slave, one hosts the map, others can edit

Jupstar ✪

u have to reject actions if they are "outdated" bcs the clients got out of sync

Yes, if new info comes in which contradict the current info sent, it needs to signal it to all other clients

it doesn't make sense to implement something unless users want it, in this case: mappers

archimede67

but also this is simply a huge effort for a thing that almost nobody will use since a big chunk of mappers are solo mappers

huge effort. You literally have to make an API which handles map actions

Cellegen

huge effort. You literally have to make an API which handles map actions

you really don't understand

AssassinTee

I suggest master slave, one hosts the map, others can edit

port forwarding just for mapping together? idk

have the client recieve the data, have the API make it understandable, read actions, apply actions

if it's so simple why don't you go ahead and implement it (edited)

same from client: Send the actions through the API, API sends it to the server, server calculates actions, back the step 1

wait, can't filesyncing be done between users with other software? patigas twmap-edit tool can convert maps into directory structures, and then you can sync them instead of the map/client, this could be done in a client patch

archimede67

if it's so simple why don't you go ahead and implement it (edited)

Lame response

3

no

Teero

port forwarding just for mapping together? idk

a lot of mappers host a local server anyway, I do at least

@Cellegen it's not completely trivial

Yes, literally anyone in this team can implement it, I am the one who lays down the foundation of the idea and the implementation of the system

09:53

I know cuz you devs are amazing

09:53

I cant think of anyone who cannot code it off.

as i said:

u need to make sure to not do out of bounds stuff (so lot of hardening vs no network)
u need to handle all actions through action events (e.g. undo/redo managers) no other way

1

Cellegen

So, still I don't have the authority to say what the devs can or cannot do, but this idea of having contributal interaction inside the editor may be possible and since there is a live example (https://github.com/k2d222/twwe/issues) where the foundation of the idea is there, it's not that difficult to do.

did you write that?

09:53

the project

heinrich5991

did you write that?

Yes, I don't think I sent off malicious intent from it justatest

09:55

All in all, I only think about the developers pushing this idea away, because they officialize their opinions as a fact?

09:55

Like would you not rather make a poll about this idea to the community?

Having an idea is fine, but having a use for that idea is better

09:55

yeah

You know, cuz since it's a community driven game, would make sense (edited)

Cellegen

Yes, I don't think I sent off malicious intent from it justatest

sorry, I mean: did you implement this project?

Cellegen

Like would you not rather make a poll about this idea to the community?

as I said, I asked a few experienced mappers about it and said it would be useless

heinrich5991

sorry, I mean: did you implement this project?

I have a prototype map editor project in Godot, where handling Object is similar to handling Quads and Tiles, yet cannot read data from tw maps

09:56

I have my own experience regarding handling data

now we could make a poll in mapping channel to gather more opinions (edited)

And I think, if I could ever read map data inside my own editor, I could make an interface for online contribution

I wouldn't do a poll unless someone wants to implement it

1

2

Cellegen

I have a prototype map editor project in Godot, where handling Object is similar to handling Quads and Tiles, yet cannot read data from tw maps

why can't you read data from tw maps? There are python bindings for doing this, also the map file format is fully documented

heinrich5991

I wouldn't do a poll unless someone wants to implement it

I would

@Cellegen smth like that doesn't belong in the client

09:57

too much bloat

but yeah

rather make an external tool that can sync multiple mappers + a live server all at once

heinrich5991

I wouldn't do a poll unless someone wants to implement it

because otherwise people will be disappointed

I mean, the website version is there I give it that

09:58

it's amazing really

louis

too much bloat

I find the word "bloat" too vague

i havent seen the source code of the web version, but is it really robust?

unnecessary maintenance for little reward

thanks

09:58

I think cooperative map editors are cool. especially when they're live on the server

Jupstar ✪

i havent seen the source code of the web version, but is it really robust?

https://github.com/k2d222/twwe/issues

Issues · k2d222/twwe

Teeworlds collaborative map editor online. Contribute to k2d222/twwe development by creating an account on GitHub.

I'd guess that there's demand for this, even if mappers don't know it yet

Cellegen

https://github.com/k2d222/twwe/issues

that's not my question

eh

getting out of sync is a matter of timing

or matter of restricting more actions

the thing needs to have some sort of synchronization model is what @Jupstar ✪ is saying

i also think in-game map editing is better explored through something like #7666

https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/issues/7666

Add netmessage to update tiles in the map · Issue #7666 · ddnet/ddn...

Not sure how exactly it should look like. I quickly came up with a poc that looks like this NetMessageEx("Sv_ModifyTile", "modify-tile@netmsg.ddnet.org", [ NetIntAny("m_X&q...

Jupstar ✪

getting out of sync is a matter of timing

I think it's okay as long as you don't have collisions

and a way of reconciling different colliding steps

10:00

e.g. by dropping htem

If the client would not be compromised to other developers (aka using it as intended), you can restrict any further actions, till the current action is sent to the server and verifies it

AssassinTee

I think it's okay as long as you don't have collisions

yes, that's what i spent a lot of time for, and this is also the part i'd consider not trivial