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Between 2022-12-15 00:00:00Z and 2022-12-16 00:00:00Z
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Is Cavings 1 map supposed to be completely dark?
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vote another map then vote back
01:36
its bugged since ddnet 10
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play with entities
01:42
(and curse all maps that are more playable in entities view than outside of it)
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heinrich5991
(and curse all maps that are more playable in entities view than outside of it)
so all maps? justatest
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entities gang
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louis
vote another map then vote back
Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 06:55:59Z
You have to restart the client. It uses client time
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maps can do that?
06:57
i mean i know about Client-Uptime.map, but how is it done?
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 06:58:39Z
There is a timer in Map layers and it's never resetting
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On which hosting sites are DDNet servers?
10:29
For some servers I don't know, some have to be kept secret, but the others are listed there as comments
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Thx
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@deen are maps like Not Really Yo'Ci temporary or points for completing them will stay? (edited)
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I'm not sure yet
12:43
We have to decide this after the event
12:44
The maps for the Advent of DDNet are so spontaneous that I sometimes receive them 30 min before new day starts πŸ˜„
12:44
So excuse any bad planning
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Jupstar βœͺ
You have to restart the client. It uses client time
i thought synchronized envelopes use map time
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louis
i thought synchronized envelopes use map time
Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:40:49Z
But it's not synced is it
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synchronized use map time
13:41
unsynchronized use client start time
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:43:35Z
For maps like this there should probably be a third option synced to race time. But it would only work on maps which teleport you away, bcs it looks really bad if an animation randomly jumps around xd
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this is a bad example of a map for which this would be useful
13:44
you shouldn't play with visibility
13:44
this just leads to people playing with entities
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:44:18Z
I mean it's a cool idea
13:44
Tbh entities are always better than design
13:44
To play
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then why the fuck do this?
13:44
if you're only going to play in entities either way
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:44:59Z
For fun
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for annoying people who don't play with entities
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:45:15Z
I'd maybe play a boring Map like this in design
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that seems not useful
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I think we broke some older maps when we did the sync changes btw, I don’t remember what but I remember Ama telling me we broke some
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that partiuclar map should just have its effect removed
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heinrich5991
for annoying people who don't play with entities
Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:46:13Z
Well for an irrelevant Map like this it's kinda acceptable
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the map design serves no purpose in this case
13:46
it might as well not be there
13:46
it forces people to play with entities
13:47
(no purpose for palying)
13:47
maybe a purpose of "fun to look at"
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:47:24Z
It doesnt force it. Else all design forces u
13:47
Considering the but would be fixed
13:47
Bug
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not really
13:48
even then, people would only play it with entities
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:48:10Z
100% xd
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because the visibility changes
13:48
there are many maps that are very playable and enjoyable without playing in entities
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:48:34Z
U talk again when u play insane gores with round freeze
13:48
We
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hm?
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:49:01Z
Round corner freeze
13:49
Then u understand all design forces u to play entities. Bcs it's simply not accurate
13:49
Visually
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yes, that's also bad design ^^
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heinrich5991
that partiuclar map should just have its effect removed
i agree since its bugged
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if you have diagonal freeze
13:50
ah, you mean rounded corners?
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 13:50:25Z
Yeah^^
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those are kinda okay for me, but I don't play insane gores
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easier maps should have clear entiries but at harder lebels you can kinda get a bit more stylish cuz more and more use entities xd
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but if they're unplayable, then the design of the map should adapt
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louis
easier maps should have clear entiries but at harder lebels you can kinda get a bit more stylish cuz more and more use entities xd
that's a bad idea IMO
13:51
that means the design shouldn't be there
13:51
it means we failed at map design
13:51
if the design is only "nice to look at" and not "nice to play in"
13:51
design serves a purpose
13:51
I can make my program look super nice
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no i mean its still playable just not as much as entities
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but that's not useful
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no acceptable design would be more clear than entities imo
13:51
since you always have some sort of contrast
13:52
and your brain has to mentally re-adjust to the tiles
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wdym by contrast?
13:54
it'd be good if we had clear design guidelines
13:54
so that not every map uses completely different design that you have to adjust to, yes
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heinrich5991
wdym by contrast?
like theres generally some mountain or doodad in design thst makes it slightly harder to see
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heinrich5991
the map design serves no purpose in this case
The purpose for it was to make people finish the map fast and have a strict point to where your lamp runs out of oil and you dont see anything
13:57
the map was covered using entities to not make anyone cheat like that
13:57
but with the years entities were removed
13:57
and you broke my map with the new animations
13:58
the effect can be removed as its just super annoying now that it doesnt work at all
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louis
like theres generally some mountain or doodad in design thst makes it slightly harder to see
the background shouldn't have colors all too similar to the foreground, if you mean that
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Ama
the map was covered using entities to not make anyone cheat like that
I think at some point it was considered bad to not be able to play maps with entities
13:59
if we consider that premise true, the map's original idea simply doesn't work anymore
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heinrich5991
the background shouldn't have colors all too similar to the foreground, if you mean that
i know, but it always makes at least a miniscule bit harder
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heinrich5991
I think at some point it was considered bad to not be able to play maps with entities
Yeah it doesnt work anymore due to the changes made . and i accept that
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heinrich5991
I think at some point it was considered bad to not be able to play maps with entities
well no i disagree, i think maps were totallt fine before
14:01
but entities are just really overpowered from a visual standpoint
14:01
we shouldnt base rules on them
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I think that's great. it nudges people to make non-stupid designs if they want people to play without entities
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 14:03:11Z
The simple fact that entities provides information like teleport number will already be enough for most ppl to stay with entities
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heinrich5991
I think that's great. it nudges people to make non-stupid designs if they want people to play without entities
yes but then we just grt designs that are just the entities tiles over a grey background πŸ˜…
14:04
like cyberfighters map
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why me
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louis
yes but then we just grt designs that are just the entities tiles over a grey background πŸ˜…
which is pretty much what most of the community sees anyway XD
14:05
i dont remember a map i played without entities to be honest
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heinrich5991
I think that's great. it nudges people to make non-stupid designs if they want people to play without entities
"why should i bother making design if 99% of people use entities"
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Jupstar βœͺ 2022-12-15 14:06:37Z
Sometimes when i turn them off I'm surprised how the map looks like xdd
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heinrich5991
I think that's great. it nudges people to make non-stupid designs if they want people to play without entities
Many people just refuse to play without entities and don't even look at the design for a second to give it a chance. Also the more complex a design is the more distractions there are, so should we only make some colored square blocks against a flat background because it's the clearest? Entities also make it impossible to map a lot of awesome mechanic ideas that depend on the map's visuals. Honestly entities should just be a feature for mapping and debugging maps and not be allowed on official servers, but sadly the community would go berserk if we made such a change.
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Ravillion and Nostalgia no entites look and play so nice (other maps too but these 2 came to mind)
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stronghold because its almost the same
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Ravie
Many people just refuse to play without entities and don't even look at the design for a second to give it a chance. Also the more complex a design is the more distractions there are, so should we only make some colored square blocks against a flat background because it's the clearest? Entities also make it impossible to map a lot of awesome mechanic ideas that depend on the map's visuals. Honestly entities should just be a feature for mapping and debugging maps and not be allowed on official servers, but sadly the community would go berserk if we made such a change.
I start playing each map with design. But on harder maps I sometimes have trouble telling hook from unhook apart or remembering which is which, so as the map progresses I might switch to entities. For example on Yo'Ci tonight I find the hookable too close in color to unhookable. You also have to consider that ~8% of males are colorblind, so there should be a clear bright vs dark contrast between hookable and unhookable (edited)
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being forced to use a design you don't like is just wrong too
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I'm not colorblind but my screen is pretty dim, so it feels a bit similar maybe πŸ˜„
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Ama
i dont remember a map i played without entities to be honest
there's Sincera, also some other few that are better played without entities that I can't recall right now. I started as an entity hater, now I can't play without it. I think it became a habit just because when u play lots of different maps, the hookable of many maps are different...and a hookable in a map it can be an unhookable in another and it's pretty annoying. Especially if it is "gores" or some sort of hook and swing parts. I remember turning off entities also for some drag maps, where the part was fully covered by some buttons or some hookthroughs are not clear
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! Dizel Graphic 2022-12-15 17:54:54Z
How do you finish logging into ddnet @Hanz-ddnet
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thekid36
there's Sincera, also some other few that are better played without entities that I can't recall right now. I started as an entity hater, now I can't play without it. I think it became a habit just because when u play lots of different maps, the hookable of many maps are different...and a hookable in a map it can be an unhookable in another and it's pretty annoying. Especially if it is "gores" or some sort of hook and swing parts. I remember turning off entities also for some drag maps, where the part was fully covered by some buttons or some hookthroughs are not clear
But thats because you are forced to turn it off otherwise I would never look at the maps design . But casual players definitly need the design and its a nice way to promote the game with beautiful maps
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JimmyJazzThe1st 2022-12-15 20:15:17Z
I didnt use entities until like 4 or 5 years of playing. No matter the map. Also got to think about speed runs and youtube videos. I know i dont like watching in entities.
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Designs are important for when a speedrun of the map gets uploaded somewhere
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