DDraceNetwork - developer

DDraceNetwork

Development / developer

Development discussion. Logged to https://ddnet.tw/irclogs/ Connected with DDNet's IRC channel, Matrix room and GitHub repositories — IRC: #ddnet on Quakenet | Matrix: #ddnet-developer:matrix.org GitHub: https://github.com/ddnet

Between 2022-10-28 00:00:00Z and 2022-10-29 00:00:00Z

deen

Should we periodically clear symbols for old releases? They are taking 12 GB already: https://ddnet.org/downloads/symbols/

I guess the nightly symbols from over weeks ago are not that useful

Didnt even know that existed

perfection

Ryozuki

Click to see attachment 🖼️

Image attachment

https://github.com/dandavison/delta

GitHub - dandavison/delta: A syntax-highlighting pager for git, dif...

A syntax-highlighting pager for git, diff, and grep output - GitHub - dandavison/delta: A syntax-highlighting pager for git, diff, and grep output

06:28

Image attachment

06:28

my neovim getting better

@deen how much telemetry data does steam offer? Like does it say which GPUs are used by players of ddnet?

https://deck-24abcd.netlify.app/

07:10

this is cool AF

oh nice, a friend even plays this card game

Css only

Jupstar ✪

oh nice, a friend even plays this card game

duh its pokemon xd

i know

07:12

but its defs not the greatest TCG XD

07:12

its very luck based

I guess never played it

what is yours all moral standpoint to basic telemetry? gpu, cpu, ram integer config variables for string config variables only if they differ from the default, so nothing leaked (some expcetion e.g. gfx_backend)

07:24

and operating system xdd

xd

07:29

If its opt in its ok

07:29

If its opt out not

opt in is useless lets face it

no

i mean who searches the option

Just a popout on first open

and clicks on send crash reports

I do for steak

thats smth different

Steam

07:30

Its opt in

its both at the same time xD

I dont want a system that silently has telemetry on by def

07:31

And u dont know it

we actually already have some kind of telemetry anyway the username is sent to the ddnet http info requests

07:33

for the finishes

07:33

that leaks more personal information than any of my above stuff

07:34

how much data is inside the http headers sent by curl?

Probs not much

anyway non ideologicly ddnet rn has your username & all ingame chat unencrypted, all input data ever made vs i just want some information that helps for development and contains no private data

https://feedback.wildfiregames.com/ they have quite a bit of insight, but mostly linux users play that game. and for some reason most linux users seem to use intel computers apparently xD

08:08

i also dont trust the data too much. GL_VERSION might report the gl version requested by the game not the one supported at max

@Jupstar ✪ im sure our windows users are happy to say yes to telemetry

08:13

BASED

the problem is really that the word itself triggers ppl

08:14

i understand that u dont want to leak all shit so its sold to google

Just state clearly what is gathered

08:14

Being honest is the best here

yes

Most ppl will say yes, i wanna flex my 4090 gpu to the stats

08:15

BASED

lmao

08:15

this is always my motivation when steam hardware survey pops up

08:15

lets make linux great xD

xd

man i'd really love to drop all backends other than vk i have some cool ideas that would be easier to develop if i wont need to change all other backends too and test all shit xD

@Jupstar ✪ can u just add features exclusive to vulkan?

yes but its hard to keep it clean

Sadge

the higher lvl code always has to do ifs like (backend supports this and that) ..

Stupid old hardware

08:21

BASED

@Ryozuki how much disk space does ur new OS use btw? i am already out of disk space again xD 1.5 TB SSD are simply not enough

Idk

08:29

But it has to fetch src when installing so

08:29

I got 2x m2 500gb and a 2tb sss

08:29

Ssd

Ryozuki

Idk

You might want to delete your distfiles every once in a while

Quad::new(50 * 2i32.pow(15), 30 * 2i32.pow(15)) @Patiga i had this in twmap 0.6 but on 0.9 it uses some weird integer with fractional bits

09:19

do you know how to use it? xD im confused

09:20

https://docs.rs/twmap/0.7.0/twmap/struct.Quad.html#method.new vs https://docs.rs/twmap/latest/twmap/struct.Quad.html#method.new

Quad in twmap - Rust

API documentation for the Rust Quad struct in crate twmap.

Quad in twmap - Rust

API documentation for the Rust Quad struct in crate twmap.

Looks like a fixed point number, which is what we use in the actual data anyway

i see

09:24

maybe twmap could reexport the "fixed" crate

09:24

anyway i imported it for the types

09:24

Quad::new(Default::default(), Point::new(50.into(), 30.into()))

09:24

seems to work

09:24

(well didnt test ingame)

Do you even need the intos?

09:25

Oh, you probably do

Yes because the new doesnt accept Into<I17F15>

09:25

But rather the I17F15 itself

09:26

A pr maybe would be worth

09:26

xd

09:27

If only it was on github

09:28

Quad::new(Default::default(), Point::new(I17F15::from_num(50), I17F15::from_num(30)))

09:28

ok it needs to be this

Tater

Is quite amazing the ratio of contributors to stars is about 1:2 I wonder if ddnet has the most contributors of any open source game

probably not. minetest? mindustry?

ddnet is good in one thing, keeping players playing

10:01

mindustry has only 300 players currently on steam

Ryozuki

Quad::new(Default::default(), Point::new(I17F15::from_num(50), I17F15::from_num(30)))

Does From<i32> do from_bits? That's a bit of a sad api choice on their part

10:04

Going from an integer to a fixed point I'd expect a 0 fractional part and my integer, but I guess that'd need to be a TryFrom because it may be out of range

Jupstar ✪

mindustry has only 300 players currently on steam

cuz you can download mindustry for free from itch.io or github

bcs the average player does that xD

10:04

ok maybe indeed bcs it cost

10:05

but i'd still assume he made most money mobile?

10:05

mobile players buy stuff and then dont use it xd

indeed

justatest

but now i am interested in their player counts

10:06

the problem with games like mindustry is that they get boring after a while

Over a million players on Steam got DDNet (but only 860k started it)

Image attachment

oh nice still very impressive

I'm trying to load the Hardware survey page, but it just hangs so far

Damn

Now it loaded but Firefox crashed during screenshot

Image attachment

10:39

Do people have to opt into the Hardware Survey? If so, then it's pretty useless

10:40

Of course people with better hardware will opt in more often

On steam yes

10:40

Still steam survey is one of the best data out there

@Jupstar ✪ Does it help as a screenshot?

Image attachment

nouis

2

deen

@Jupstar ✪ Does it help as a screenshot?

yeah good enough thx

yeah some interesting stats ~40% laptop users.. thats quite high RAM <4GB 1% VRAM <1GB 4.53% SSE3 100% around 5.4% with GPUs that are really old, ivy bridge, haswell, some old ATI cards etc. (edited)

Do we compile with sse3

10:59

?

do we have a usecase? i'd assume some libraries we use do it

11:02

on the other hand i think clang does some vectorization with o2 already if i remember correctly but gcc doesnt tho i dunno which instructions this results in

depends on the target architecture it's compiling for

yeah i mean for x64 ofc

Jupstar ✪

yeah some interesting stats ~40% laptop users.. thats quite high RAM <4GB 1% VRAM <1GB 4.53% SSE3 100% around 5.4% with GPUs that are really old, ivy bridge, haswell, some old ATI cards etc. (edited)

I can see the benefit of laptops, even as someone who never moves their computer. They are much lower power consumption and nowadays easily fast enough.

well depends what u want to do xD

I'd probably get a mobile CPU instead of some desktop beast that goes to > 5 GHz

i consider laptops as insanly slow, especially the GPUs are really bad

11:04

yes single threaded laptops are quite ok

Sure, but DDNet runs fine

Jupstar ✪

yeah i mean for x64 ofc

it still depends. there are multiple targets for x86-64, depending on the level of support you want

Jupstar ✪

i consider laptops as insanly slow, especially the GPUs are really bad

I mean even relatively they aren't THAT slow, insanely is a bit of an overreach, no?

Learath2

I mean even relatively they aren't THAT slow, insanely is a bit of an overreach, no?

depends i guess, if u ok with 720p gaming on mid graphics or not being able to run blender well enough

I need my fast cpu

11:06

Laptops are so slow

gpu wise yes, I was thinking cpu

for me personally a fast GPU is important. its annoying if stuff doesnt run well

11:06

and programs tend to use GPUs more and more

11:06

more workload is shifted to the GPU i mean

I compile a lot of rust so i like having a beefy cpu

11:07

BASED

11:08

And noise isnt a problem to me

11:08

My headset cancels noise passively

11:08

And i put music

11:08

greenthing

I took a quick look at 4th gen just as an example. The flagship i7 turbos up to 4.4GHz. The flagship i7 mobile turbos up to 4.0GHz. It's just a 400MHz difference. It's even better in 10th gen

11:09

Mobile gpus though yeah, not the best honestly but if you want workstation performance there are beastly laptops too, if you are ok with carrying them around

deen

I'd probably get a mobile CPU instead of some desktop beast that goes to > 5 GHz

another problem is that laptops are quite expensive for what they can do

They rly are

for 500 bucks i get 16 core desktop cpu

And thry often come with just 500gb

I'd probably get a laptop CPU in a desktop case if that is still possible

Used to be easy, but no sockets on laptops for a while now :/

oh ok

11:11

u can simply undervolt and downclock

11:11

if its such a problem

deen

I'd probably get a laptop CPU in a desktop case if that is still possible

Used to be easy, but no sockets on laptops for a while now :/

There is that one chinese guy that solders BGA laptop cpus to adapters and sells them

most of the time CPUs run idle anyway

Why do u want a slower cpu?

so the 5GHz are just nice to have

11:12

my cpu runs under 7W in idle

even the idle power consumption of recent desktop CPUs is pretty high

my gpu similar

German article, but idle CPU power of 20 W is bad

Image attachment

I'd probably keep a normal desktop but I can definitely see the value proposition of a laptop, being able to move around is just great/10

deen

even the idle power consumption of recent desktop CPUs is pretty high

u shouldnt underestimate one thing new GPUs have much more cores, so they can do more with less energy the problem is at around 80% usage.. .then desktop stuff gets inefficient

deen

German article, but idle CPU power of 20 W is bad

why?

11:14

20 is nothing

11:14

use a train one time and u wasted more energy than 1 year running this idle

The train isn't outputting its waste heat into my hot summer apartment though

mhh 20W is not lot of heat

deen

The train isn't outputting its waste heat into my hot summer apartment though

Run the AC 4head

the processor is like 3cm big

11:15

its not enough to heat a 1m² of a room

Jupstar ✪

the processor is like 3cm big

Size of the CPU mattereth not actually, 20W is 20W

Learath2

Size of the CPU mattereth not actually, 20W is 20W

yes but its still not lot of heat on 1m²

It's not just the CPU, mainboard etc have also increased in power consumption in recent years

20W on the full room is nothing anyway

Jupstar ✪

yes but its still not lot of heat on 1m²

Yeah, 20W isn't much heat. Just wanted to say the cpu size isn't a factor

Learath2

Yeah, 20W isn't much heat. Just wanted to say the cpu size isn't a factor

my point was really more about where the heat is

The thing about heat is that it doesn't like staying where it is

air is a pretty good isolation (edited)

Anyway, I don't like that desktops went from idling at ~25 Watt to 50 Watt in the last 6 years

Jupstar ✪

air is a pretty good isolation (edited)

Air will not conduct heat well, but it will heat up, the 20W of heat has to go somewhere

Learath2

Air will not conduct heat well, but it will heat up, the 20W of heat has to go somewhere

yeah but it will not heat the full room

11:21

heat tends to go to the top

11:21

as soon as its dark outside in germany it will cool again xD

As far as my understanding of thermodynamics goes, the universe really doesn't like heat gradients, warm air and cold air will exchange heat until equilibrium. Now whether the amount of temperature change due to the heat is negligible or not, that's up to you

turn off your light and u save 30Watt

11:23

remove the sunlight and u probs save over 20Watts

I use leds, those are like 6W

11:24

Can't remove the sun, it'd be great though

remove your body and u probs save over 100watt

boo

1

Learath2

Can't remove the sun, it'd be great though

close the whatever u have at your window

Can't remove body either, humans can't be uploaded to the cloud ye

boo

1

Learath2

I use leds, those are like 6W

your room light has 6watt?

11:24

then gg

11:24

thats not enough for me

Jupstar ✪

close the whatever u have at your window

Radiation still heats the windows and my walls

anyway

11:26

u also have to take the difference anyway

11:26

a laptop also uses 5watts or smth

Jupstar ✪

thats not enough for me

Really? These modern 7W bulbs are like equivalent to 60W incandescents

so we already at 15W

Learath2

Really? These modern 7W bulbs are like equivalent to 60W incandescents

yeah dunno i think mine is like 18watts, the transformator also looses some energy

protip: run your lightbulb underpowered too, then it lasts much longer

11:28

and is more efficient, less waste heat

^^ez

Anyway, as I said. I'd probably keep a desktop cpu aswell. Just saying no matter the wattage the size of the cpu, there is heat being output and it'll heat the room

anyway, for me as said its not even so much about the CPU, but GPU, and desktop GPUs are like mini computers, with own mainboards etc. so i have to accept they use extra energy

3 W bulbs can be 60 W incandescent equivalent like that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klaJqofCsu4

The lamps you're not allowed to have. Exploring the Dubai lamps

deen

3 W bulbs can be 60 W incandescent equivalent like that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klaJqofCsu4

I was just about to say have you seen those dubai bulbs

i can ensure my room light isnt the most efficient xD

I can get 7W =~ 60W ones in europe, they get cool 3W ones

I do something similar for a long time. I got SceneSwitch LEDs and rarely run them at their full brightness level, so far none have failed.

I haven't had a led lamp fail in 4 years I think even at full power

11:32

I seem to have gotten lucky on the silicone lottery

Yeah, only some designs are bad and easily overheat

just judge yourself @Learath2 xD

Image attachment

11:33

but my lamp also has different lighting modes

11:35

my gpu uses around 30W in ddnet with 1400fps

11:35

thats not nothing but an old laptop could not do it at 30W

11:37

the good thing here is: the desktop GPUs have much more shader cores than laptop GPUs (except maybe M1 Max) so they dont have to clock so high to archive the same goal

11:37

since my gpu is <20% usage its pretty efficient

Yeah, GPUs are not at 5 GHz (yet), but CPUs have been going crazy recently just to get 5% faster FPS than the other side

me: just make the maps less gpu heavy lol

11:40

justatest

just drop old hardware and force vulkan, set a good limit that suits your needs and be happy

deen

Yeah, GPUs are not at 5 GHz (yet), but CPUs have been going crazy recently just to get 5% faster FPS than the other side

Honestly, I'm happy as long as I get stable framerates around my refresh rate. It just looks good to me, maybe I just don't have good eyes

11:44

One of the reasons I upgrade my system so slowly. Things just don't look that bad to me with almost any stable fps

when i read phoronix and see all the progress for new software technology i actually wonder when the old hardware will be dropped, or will they always fall back to software rendering?

11:44

i mean the maintainance cant be worth it for old stuff

didn't intel announced something about saving money?

Jupstar ✪

i mean the maintainance cant be worth it for old stuff

I guess the fact that old hardware just doesn't change makes it better maintenance cost wise

i wish i'd have av1 encoding on my GPU :/

Now that'd be sth I'd upgrade for

next amd will have it, rtx 4090 also has it

get an arc gpu and use it just to decode/encode av1

xd

Xd

Actually, I think arc would be a great fit for you @Jupstar ✪

11:51

It's so extremely opinionated that it refuses to work well with old gfx APIs

i fear intels drivers

11:51

i am on the dark side then

I heard it's quickly getting better after the release

tbh, if i have a good vulkan driver, i have all drivers

11:52

dxvk, zink

11:52

i can even run my window manager under zink already

11:52

minecraft worked good enough

11:52

maybe 80% of native GL driver

Run the arc on a server to encode av1 solely

i need it for streaming my desktop xd

12:04

h264 struggles with high refresh rates

You can just have an extra arc for av1

or vaapi is it

Learath2

You can just have an extra arc for av1

yeah ez money boy

12:05

ddnet gives me so much money per month

12:05

i buy rtx 4090 every day

What is a little money in pursuit of more fps? Cmon, just don’t eat

good idea actually learath

12:05

vulkan has multi gpu support

12:06

imagine u could render demos in the background

12:06

would be cool

It’d be nice if I could render headless from the terminal

mhhh yeah

12:07

but would still require a vk instance, just without a surface

That’s fine I guess

guess i should think about it

Do it

at some point i have to add framebuffer rendering anyway at least for vulkan

12:09

its simply too annoying to have the ddnet window open all the time

Can u have a vk instance without a gpu?

well cpu rendering

To make a server to render demos

12:09

Ok

12:09

Future service

12:10

Now just need top 10 rank demos auto published

that would be cool indeed

12:10

if we'd finally have teehistorian to demo

12:10

it would motivate me

12:16

mhh is it safe to call Localize whenever i want to?

12:17

kinda feels weird to call it inside the backend tho

12:17

maybe i should enumerize the errors and give them text only in the higher level components^^

Jupstar ✪

maybe i should enumerize the errors and give them text only in the higher level components^^

This probably is the correct way to do this

yeah just lot of work

12:19

54 different errors in vulkan backend

12:19

<<

rust Result

12:36

Imagine not having sum types smh

how does that fix my problem

12:47

i am thinking about a Localizable function that is empty and only there so the translation script can find the string of the backend too

Jupstar ✪

i am thinking about a Localizable function that is empty and only there so the translation script can find the string of the backend too

@deen u ok with this? then we can also remove all the comments like // Locaize("...")

12:56

matches = re.findall(r"Localize\s*\(\s*\"([^\"]+)\"(?:\s*,\s*\"([^\"]+)\")?\s*\)", fileobj.read()) ui, that's what i call a regex (edited)

justatest

@Jupstar ✪ man

13:34

i change the file with name Teeworlds and

13:35

i start the game and every thing get Change and i change the file name to Teeworlds again and i didnt get my old game

13:35

still everything new

iISAF7

@Jupstar ✪ man

it now uses DDnet file

13:37

always close client before you do stuff like this

Jupstar ✪

always close client before you do stuff like this

i did

normally it uses teeworlds directory first, then ddnet if u renamed teeworlds to ddnet it used ddnet

13:39

what did u name it?

Jupstar ✪

@deen u ok with this? then we can also remove all the comments like // Locaize("...")

What is it good for?

deen

What is it good for?

i can use strings in backend without needing to localize them there

that doesn't work for formatted strings, I think

15:40

I don't know if you need those

i dont need them

15:42

its just that i dont want to add a // Localize("...") comment to every string

15:43

and handling all errors by enums just to convert them to strings later is lot of coding and also kinda code dublication

15:43

since they arent really error types, but more like error descriptions

@deen how often is the sqlite db download updated on ddnet stats page?

15:50

Using the mysql db is not feasible for me

15:51

Takes way too long on my pc with a good cpu, cant image on a vps

15:51

Oh

15:52

Maybe i should use csv

15:52

And polars

15:52

Did you know the rust csv library is one of the best out there

15:52

Surpasing in speed the c++ ones

15:55

https://github.com/pola-rs/polars https://github.com/BurntSushi/rust-csv

Ryozuki

@deen how often is the sqlite db download updated on ddnet stats page?

every night

nice

15:56

@heinrich5991 do u know if its more worth to use csv or sqlite when perfoming read only queries?

15:57

i wonder if polars is faster than sqlite itself making queries

16:03

Probs csv

https://blog.rust-lang.org/2022/10/28/gats-stabilization.html

Generic associated types to be stable in Rust 1.65 | Rust Blog

Empowering everyone to build reliable and efficient software.

16:26

As of Rust 1.65, which is set to release on November 3rd, generic associated types (GATs) will be stable — over six and a half years after the original RFC was opened. This is truly a monumental achievement; however, as with a few of the other monumental features of Rust, like async or const generics, there are limitations in the initial stabilization that we plan to remove in the future.

Mr.Gh0s7

Is this a good place for the tiles?

I moved them here. It seems like they are getting ignored. Any ideas why?

Image attachment

why should they magically work

16:32

is the server using the same slots?

I made the neccesary changes to the code

the client filters invalid tiles

16:33

maplayers.cpp

It's a server side issue currently

ah no, we moved it to mapimages.cpp

16:34

IsValidGameTile

I added this line (Index >= TILE_SPIKE_FIRST && Index <= TILE_SPIKE_LAST) ||

16:34

in mapitems.cpp (edited)

16:35

and these lines on mapitems.h

    TILE_SPIKE_RED = TILE_SPIKE_FIRST,
    TILE_SPIKE_ORANGE,
    TILE_SPIKE_YELLOW,
    TILE_SPIKE_GREEN,
    TILE_SPIKE_LBLUE,
    TILE_SPIKE_BLUE,
    TILE_SPIKE_PURPLE,
    TILE_SPIKE_PINK,
    TILE_SPIKE_WHITE,
    TILE_SPIKE_BLACK,
    TILE_SPIKE_LAST = TILE_SPIKE_BLACK,

hey guys quick question: how many requests can i make to https://master1.ddnet.org/ddnet/15/servers.json in what amount of time so i don't get ratelimited/blacklisted

Check cloudflare limits

16:37

Cuz its behind that

Mr.Gh0s7

I added this line (Index >= TILE_SPIKE_FIRST && Index <= TILE_SPIKE_LAST) ||

and ur server acts as ddrace server?

yeah

just look with a debugger why its not inside i guess

the previous tile positions worked (the previous shared image from tile 114), so I thought it may be a blacklist tileissue or smt like that? (edited)

if(n == MAP_IMAGE_ENTITY_LAYER_TYPE_GAME && !IsValidGameTile((int)TileIndex)) ValidTile = false;

16:40

if it doesnt meet the condition

16:40

it should work

Ryozuki

Check cloudflare limits

thanks

Alexander

hey guys quick question: how many requests can i make to https://master1.ddnet.org/ddnet/15/servers.json in what amount of time so i don't get ratelimited/blacklisted

There is no ratelimit, once per second I wouldn't mind, everything more often seems excessive

16:44

We archive it every 2 seconds our selves

That is in the client code I am having problem with the server code. The tee doesn't die on the tile/the tile doesn't get printed on HandleTiles on character.cpp under server/entities Maybe it's considered another layer? (edited)

so im safe if i do something like 1 refresh per 5 seconds

yes

great, thanks

what are you doing with it? @Alexander

im showing 3 servers on a website and their player count and if they are online

16:46

here is a preview

Mr.Gh0s7

That is in the client code I am having problem with the server code. The tee doesn't die on the tile/the tile doesn't get printed on HandleTiles on character.cpp under server/entities Maybe it's considered another layer? (edited)

dunno the ddrace code but in vanilla some tiles are simply filtered in collisions.cpp

Image attachment

Alexander

im showing 3 servers on a website and their player count and if they are online

why not make it client side?

currently it doesn't auto refresh but im planning on doing it every 5 seconds if viable

https://aliveclan.de/#home here ^ it just downloads the json

16:48

the server json allows cors

i don't understand what you mean by client side

and an interval with 5 seconds is ez in js

it's already client side?

ah ok

basically a javascript fetch function fetching servers.json and then filtering for specific servers by finding the ip address

Ryozuki

@heinrich5991 do u know if its more worth to use csv or sqlite when perfoming read only queries?

I don't know. my guess would be sqlite

if it doesnt find the ip address then it's offline

yeah i see

16:49

but then you shouldnt mind too much

16:49

the fetch only happens if smone visits your site

yes, exactly

16:50

but i dont want them or me while developing to be blacklisted by ddnet

i guess its mostly cloudflares decision anyway isnt it

16:50

if they consider it ddos they filter the traffic

yeah but you could set your own parameters for ratelimiting in cloudflare so that's why i asked if you guys set any

just try it out, jkjk

troll

1

there's not much point for us to set rate limits

17:02

cloudflare handles the requests

17:02

we don't get hit by your 10,000 requests per second

heinrich5991

there's not much point for us to set rate limits

justatest

17:06

conditionally

@Alexander 1 req per second is fine

17:09

Probs 10 too

17:09

But no need

please no

17:10

1 per 5 seconds is plenty

Cloudflare caches it

i'd rather do 5 because the client needs time to download the json file and if i overdo it then it would probably break

yeah its also not really useful to generate more traffic than needed really

even 5 is too much

Im just saying that cloudflare wont ban u for 1, 10 or 30 req per second, not that u should

ah okay okay

17:11

yeah cloudflare is pretty stronk

Ryozuki

Im just saying that cloudflare wont ban u for 1, 10 or 30 req per second, not that u should

have you tried?

17:14

preferably not against ddnet.org

@heinrich5991 not rly,but i often see ratelimits on most apis at 30 reqs per second

17:18

To identify a general threshold for Cloudflare Rate Limiting, divide 24 hours of uncached website requests by the unique visitors for the same 24 hours. Then, divide by the estimated average minutes of a visit. Finally, multiply by 4 (or larger) to establish an estimated threshold per minute for your website. A value higher than 4 is fine since most attacks are an order of magnitude above typical traffic rates. To identify URL rate limits for specific URLs, use 24 hours of uncached requests and unique visitors for the specific URL. Adjust thresholds based on user reports and your own monitoring.

17:18

Idk xd

17:19

https://support.cloudflare.com/hc/en-us/articles/115001635128-Configuring-Cloudflare-Rate-Limiting

Configuring Cloudflare Rate Limiting

Configure Cloudflare Rate Limiting to protect your website application against denial-of-service attacks, brute-force login attempts, and other abusive behaviors. Overview Analytics Rate Limiting ...

but since we all good programmers we dont do it

17:22

now back to normal business any new rust libs @Ryozuki ?

Yes, rustyman

17:25

I wonder who made it

Jupstar ✪

dunno the ddrace code but in vanilla some tiles are simply filtered in collisions.cpp

Thanks that was it. It was in TileExists().

monkalaugh

Ryozuki

https://blog.rust-lang.org/2022/10/28/gats-stabilization.html

This is bigger news

when do i get virtual functions to override (edited)

Ew no

17:27

Use traits

but a dyn trait is basically that?

17:29

on asm level

@Jupstar ✪ well dyn trait is used for dynamic dispatch

17:50

We use dyn Trait over (data, vtable) for the same reason we use, references over pointers, Rc over (pointer_data, pointer_counter), Box over malloc/free. It's a safe abstraction which can be proven to not cause errors.

17:50

https://users.rust-lang.org/t/dyn-trait-vs-data-vtable/36127

Dyn trait vs (data, vtable)

Hello! New to rust, and I've been confused on the following: What are the advantages of manually constructing a (data, vtable)-like structure, rather than using a dyn trait, which itself should be a (data, vtable) representation? I've seen this pattern in: std::task::RawWaker tokio's RawTask Neither of these examples have documented the r...

Ryozuki

@Jupstar ✪ well dyn trait is used for dynamic dispatch

yeah i am fine with that

17:53

i just need the functionality

its just that rust doesnt have OOP as in inheritance

17:53

it favors composition

17:54

with the trait model

17:54

and its something generally good

i just hope it doesnt create too much more code

the cat and dog classes that plague java

17:54

thats too much code xd

17:54

i dont feel im overly verbose in rust

17:55

@Jupstar ✪ if u code in a "rusty" way it lends itself i would say

17:55

u shouldnt force a java oop style on rust

17:55

u will end up with unidiomatic code

17:55

did u read the rust book yet?

17:55

u rly should

17:56

the rust book is a web btw

17:56

https://doc.rust-lang.org/book/

The Rust Programming Language - The Rust Programming Language

17:56

this

i dont feel like i want or need this

17:56

i just need a project and then start

thats sad

17:56

u rly need this

17:56

i would say

17:56

also its pretty interesting

yeah dunno xD

17:57

i hate reading books

i also hate reading books

17:57

though this to mee didnt feel like a book

17:57

more like a introduction to the language

17:57

its not a 200 page c++ book

anyway, i dont think its worth it, u usually dont get a feeling for the abstractions if u just read

i think u do in this case

17:58

but its not just abstractions

17:58

rust introduces new things u are not used to

17:58

lifetimes

17:58

borrowing

also sometimes i look how u'd do stuff in rust, when i feel like that could be hard without unsafe rust

like what?

well we discussed this before, especially thread related stuff

not rly

17:59

the thing i like the mosti s rust thread safety

18:00

but i remember u said some weird obscure edge case

18:00

i dont remember much tho xd

yeah but every abstraction comes with a restriction

yeah these restrictions rule out all unsafe abstractions and probably some valid use cases

18:00

but more and more less valid use cases are ruled out

18:01

as rust improves

i can also write a game in javascript

18:01

its not like i cannot imagine it

Ryozuki

its not a 200 page c++ book

u right, its a 200 page rust book

and rust is nice bcs it has a better idea than all the trash langauges like java

18:01

for me its not so much about if its possible or not. More about if its actually more elegant of solution

i find rust way more elegant than c++ way often

18:02

this is due to algebraic data types

18:02

rust enums are just godly

18:03

and try to find something as good as serde

18:03

the serde author truly is a genius

18:03

https://serde.rs/

Overview · Serde

the thing that scares me about rust is how you need to do like 9000 things just to get something down

vague

Ryozuki

https://serde.rs/

Where many other languages rely on runtime reflection for serializing data, Serde is instead built on Rust's powerful trait system. A data structure that knows how to serialize and deserialize itself is one that implements Serde's Serialize and Deserialize traits (or uses Serde's derive attribute to automatically generate implementations at compile time). This avoids any overhead of reflection or runtime type information. In fact in many situations the interaction between data structure and data format can be completely optimized away by the Rust compiler, leaving Serde serialization to perform the same speed as a handwritten serializer for the specific selection of data structure and data format.

also like, you want to edit someones project? you need to find like 3 dlls and put them in a folder.

@Jupstar ✪ there are many cases where serde json serializer is faster than a hand written one xd

yes it sounds really great if you want an ez powerful solution

its ez and really configurable, and not limited to e.g 1 json serializer implementation

18:06

in fact there are multiple,

18:06

serde_json simd_json

18:06

all serde compatible

in this case i'd for example ask what if i want to do this: load only have data, and start processing these data in another thread then continue loading rest

18:06

i had use cases for such situations so i end up in an own impl

18:07

not for json tho

i mean u can do that yeah

anyway generally making it ez is better anyway

serde doesnt handle how u load the data in any way

18:07

i think u rly dont know how serde works xd

if smth is perf hit u can still optimize it later

18:07

if ur solution is stable

also it allows parsing in a streaming way by passing a reader

Ryozuki

serde doesnt handle how u load the data in any way

sounds to me like it handles datatype loading itself

no

18:08

it just handles parsing

18:08

u pass it the data

18:09

use serde::{Deserialize, Serialize};
use serde_json::Result;

#[derive(Serialize, Deserialize)]
struct Person {
    name: String,
    age: u8,
    phones: Vec<String>,
}

fn typed_example() -> Result<()> {
    // Some JSON input data as a &str. Maybe this comes from the user.
    let data = r#"
        {
            "name": "John Doe",
            "age": 43,
            "phones": [
                "+44 1234567",
                "+44 2345678"
            ]
        }"#;

    // Parse the string of data into a Person object. This is exactly the
    // same function as the one that produced serde_json::Value above, but
    // now we are asking it for a Person as output.
    let p: Person = serde_json::from_str(data)?;

    // Do things just like with any other Rust data structure.
    println!("Please call {} at the number {}", p.name, p.phones[0]);

    Ok(())
}

and whats so genius about it then?

that it parses this without any runtime reflection

18:09

and its rly ergonomic

mh

18:10

but then its just constexpr

18:10

i meant a different scenario

it handles dynamic not known data too

18:11

in serde_json it would be a Value

but if u load it from disk?

yeah same

18:12

the program works if u load the data from disk

so it has some overhead in memory consumption?

18:12

or does it save it as binary?

use serde::Deserialize;

use std::error::Error;
use std::fs::File;
use std::io::BufReader;
use std::path::Path;

#[derive(Deserialize, Debug)]
struct User {
    fingerprint: String,
    location: String,
}

fn read_user_from_file<P: AsRef<Path>>(path: P) -> Result<User, Box<dyn Error>> {
    // Open the file in read-only mode with buffer.
    let file = File::open(path)?;
    let reader = BufReader::new(file);

    // Read the JSON contents of the file as an instance of `User`.
    let u = serde_json::from_reader(reader)?;

    // Return the `User`.
    Ok(u)
}

fn main() {
    let u = read_user_from_file("test.json").unwrap();
    println!("{:#?}", u);
}

18:12

it can do 0 copy parsing

18:13

idk what u on about abotu saving

18:13

i think we are not understanding each other xd

yes u say it has zero cost basically?

well u can make it this way

18:13

in the case shown its not cuz its using owned strings

18:13

https://serde.rs/lifetimes.html

Deserializer lifetimes · Serde

18:14

Image attachment

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well brb eating

Voxel

also like, you want to edit someones project? you need to find like 3 dlls and put them in a folder.

on what rust project did that happen? hasn't been my experience so far

18:46

I only had that experience with non-rust projects, actually

cipy sent me something and when i tried to run it it was like, yelling at me for missing files or smth

18:47

so i had to like, go get the files and place them in some rust folder in my pc

weird

weird indeed

18:48

i nevern eeded any file

wtf

probs some c bindings

18:50

but yeah rust compiles staticly which i really like ^^

statically by default *

18:52

https://doc.rust-lang.org/reference/linkage.html

Linkage - The Rust Reference

i have 100 fps after i do alt tab

21:15

usually i have 5000

Smetanolub

i have 100 fps after i do alt tab

press "restart" in windows

it helps

21:28

but i need to altab and i cant play after it

Smetanolub

but i need to altab and i cant play after it

no i mean press restart

21:29

in windows

21:29

not restart the client

21:30

Image attachment

I UNDERSTAND

21:30

i said yes it helps

21:30

but i cant restart 9999999 times

install latest GPU drivers

21:31

and restart

21:31

^^

21:31

do you use vulkan or opengl ? settings -> graphics -> renderer in client

yes i do

Smetanolub

but i cant restart 9999999 times

^ try what you dont use

Smetanolub

yes i do

its not a boolean question

21:31

which one do you use

1.0.0

try opengl then

21:32

3.3

less fps

can't have it all

Smetanolub

less fps

then install latest drivers

21:33

whats ur GPU, what is your driver?

3080ti

latest driver from nvidia.com?

drivers from 07 2022

try the current one

21:34

https://www.nvidia.com/download/index.aspx?lang=en-us

Download the latest official NVIDIA drivers

Download the latest official NVIDIA drivers

How do I change renderer btw

21:35

like not in game

21:35

from game files

gfx_backend

21:37

OpenGL Vulkan

Thanks

on linux GLES

is there vulkan 2.0.0?

no

opengl 3.3.0 doesnt work for me

there is vulkan 1.3

Alexander

opengl 3.3.0 doesnt work for me

probs amd gpu

how do i use it ingame

yeye

the beta drivers are buggy

i dont think im using beta

Smetanolub

how do i use it ingame

there is no vulkan 1.3 implementation

but latest

but vulkan 1.3 is downward compatible

so u basically using vulkan 1.3

Alexander

but latest

amd calls them optional, but they also call them beta and for some reason they promote them more than their stable drivers on their website xD

21:44

dunno what their reasoning is

ah so amd = nouis

nouis

yes

and i download them cause i think that they are better to have

yeah its not your fault, i'd do that too

when in reality it means more unstable driver

and if i wouldnt know its buggy for ddnet, i'd also recommend it

there is also another thing that is happening to me that didn't happen before (before i reinstalled windows)

21:46

21:46

there is a gap when showing and hiding the taskbar (edited)

21:47

and I can't find anyone else talking about it on the internet

Jupstar ✪

amd calls them optional, but they also call them beta and for some reason they promote them more than their stable drivers on their website xD

here nvidia for example doesnt even show it, except you explicity search for beta drivers

Image attachment

Alexander

Click to see attachment 🖼️

is that also if u dont have a dynamic taskbar?

dynamic taskbar?

it always goes away

it doesn't happen since there is no animation then

21:49

but i don't like seeing the taskbar always

weird stuff

i know its the drivers since its not happening when im updating it (it disables it for a moment)

its just weird that this is caused by the GPU driver, but maybe its some weird interpolation inaccuracy in the rendering

It's weird to me that it didn't happen before i reinstalled windows

21:52

But I probably had an older version of the driver (edited)

i mean u can simply downgrade

I think I would if it was that easy

21:52

I'd have to try a lot of driver versions before I find the one that works

21:53

And the process of installing is long

i see

21:53

replace directx.dll with directx.dll from dxvk

21:53

ez

Can you explain what would that do

21:54

I feel like you are joking

i have no idea if that works with windows but in theory windows probs uses directx to render their window manager dxvk is basically, directx on vulkan

21:54

so all dx calls are translated to vk

21:54

if u have some old game and want more FPS, u can try it out

21:54

they usually easily beat dx9 drivers

Okay but would it work for windows

i dunno i never tested it

21:55

but in theory nothing speaks against it probs

I trust you so im gonna try it xd

but i cannot say what exactly needs to be replaced windows uses dxgi for all rendering, quite possible that they hacked in some microsoft exclusive stuff

Alexander

I trust you so im gonna try it xd

better google first xD

I am xd

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desktop_Window_Manager#:~:text=DWM%20uses%20DirectX%20to%20perform,screen%20buffers%20to%20the%20display.

Desktop Window Manager

Desktop Window Manager (DWM, previously Desktop Compositing Engine or DCE) is the compositing window manager in Microsoft Windows since Windows Vista that enables the use of hardware acceleration to render the graphical user interface of Windows. It was originally created to enable portions of the new "Windows Aero" user experience, which allowe...

21:57

"DWM uses DirectX to perform the function of compositing and rendering in the GPU, freeing the CPU of the task of managing the rendering from the off-screen buffers to the display. "

21:57

so maybe its actually possible

21:58

but i cannot find any post about someone trying it

lets see if i can find the right file

i already see your windows not working anymore xD

I'M TRUSTING YOU

someone has to be the first to test

maybe i should do it on a virtual machine though

that wont work

22:00

i dont know of any VM that supports vulkan

22:01

maximum as software renderer

so just do what im trying to do in vm files

22:01

wait would a virtual machine software do directx

u can also try to replace all windows files with wine files xDDDDDDDDDD

22:02

if your windows then still works gg

i found directml.dll

22:02

i guess thats not it

well you can only replace these

Image attachment

22:02

they should be in windows system32

yep found them

i hope u have a backkend if u actually doing it

22:03

backup

22:03

*

nah im not gonna try it

xD

22:03

i could do it since i have dual boot

if you said that it's safe then i'd do it no joke

22:04

but since you arent sure

i can recover from it:D

but is it a guarantee that if it works for you that it would work for me

maybe i try at some point just for fun^^

do tell how it goes =]

ok

inb4 it actually makes windows run 50% faster

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