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DDraceNetwork
Development / developer
Development discussion. Logged to https://ddnet.tw/irclogs/ Connected with DDNet's IRC channel, Matrix room and GitHub repositories — IRC: #ddnet on Quakenet | Matrix: #ddnet-developer:matrix.org GitHub: https://github.com/ddnet
Between 2022-07-26 00:00:00Z and 2022-07-27 00:00:00Z
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33 days doesn't seem that long, but that means that the server never was empty for 33 days straight?
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o i don't doubt NFT community is pretty correlated with white supremacists
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louis
Nope.
he's not that bad tbh but by the sound of it ur memeing anyway
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Chairn
33 days doesn't seem that long, but that means that the server never was empty for 33 days straight?
indeed
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Learath2
@trml don't we have door prediction nowadays?
Not yet, no, orininally i wanted se how entity ex worked for a bit before adding anything
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I'm still for replacing entitiyEx with new extended netobjects that hold all information.
00:36
Two objects for one thing plus the fact that the client has to sort them together does not sound good to me, compared to the fact that we actually have an extended netobject system
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I guess it would be only for lasers first, if the new pr gets pulled
00:38
But with the recent work on making netobjects more extendible it might be a better solution in general
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Learath2
Omg, there is a server on CHN7 that has been up for 33 days
isnt there a multeasy server at like a year or smth
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louis
isnt there a multeasy server at like a year or smth
no way 😄
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d19945e M Blue Sapphire, M Cool, M Easy 1, M Firewatch, M Fluff, M GlassBox 2, M GlassBox 3, M GlassBox 4, M GlassBox 5, M GlassBox 6, M GlassBox 7, M GlassBox, M Ice Water, M Island Rush, M Kaylite, M Kobra 3, M Little Forest, M Lonely, M Looney, M Ovell, M Pados 3, M Pounamu 2, M Seagulls, M Take it noobly - ddnet-maps
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nfts itself are not art
06:55
they are just a link that might go down
06:55
dont fool urself
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it can be other, than a picture btw and people miss that point
07:15
non fungible token != picture art
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Mass produced, low quality art is still art. Also not all nfts are bored apes. But even then, likely bad to invest
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The think is the nft itself is no art, since its not a picture but merely a http lini
07:30
Link
07:30
What the contents of that link are can change any time
07:30
Since thats served by a server external to the blockchain
07:35
this is a very good explanation
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there was an nft that changed when you bought it
07:48
from a mid piece of art to literally 💩 this emoji (edited)
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Most nfts nowadays are referenced to images or whatever hosted on blockchain hosting sites like ipfs, so the thing about them going down or being changed isn’t an issue(unless they intentionally make it that way like voxel mentioned). I think the nft art thing is really stupid but the technology behind it is really cool, like an nft could theoretically represent ownership of anything, like the title to a car or property, or it could be used to hold medical records and share them with hospitals easily. It’s a good thing for technological growth that ppl are interested in making a quick buck off the art craze but if you plan on going into that I’d recommend not staying long
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world was better without internet tho
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ipfs is still like torrent, if a file is not seeded its gone too btw
08:06
btw does anyone have example teehistorian data?
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ReiTW
world was better without internet tho
+1
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Skystrife
Most nfts nowadays are referenced to images or whatever hosted on blockchain hosting sites like ipfs, so the thing about them going down or being changed isn’t an issue(unless they intentionally make it that way like voxel mentioned). I think the nft art thing is really stupid but the technology behind it is really cool, like an nft could theoretically represent ownership of anything, like the title to a car or property, or it could be used to hold medical records and share them with hospitals easily. It’s a good thing for technological growth that ppl are interested in making a quick buck off the art craze but if you plan on going into that I’d recommend not staying long
medical records on public block chain, great idea xd (edited)
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Tater
medical records on public block chain, great idea xd (edited)
There are ways to make it encrypted and only give keys to those who need it, it would be really useful but shit never gets updated in governments with technological advancements anyways so it would be a long time before anything like that could come about
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what even is the point of being able to prove ownership over your medical records?
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It’s more about ease of access, like if you go to a different hospital or one in a different country then they are able to access it, I only mentioned it bc it’s just another thing that the technology behind nfts can do
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[quakenet] gerdoe BOT 2022-07-26 10:03:48Z
yo bros did ya see c++23 feature freeze?
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Skystrife
There are ways to make it encrypted and only give keys to those who need it, it would be really useful but shit never gets updated in governments with technological advancements anyways so it would be a long time before anything like that could come about
what would the benefit of "putting it on a blockchain" be?
11:00
you could instead have a file, signed by your medical authority instead, that you can share with hospitals. or a link to that data hosted on government servers
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The whole point of it is that it’s not owned by any one government and is a more universal thing, it’s likely the medical thing won’t come into fruition because governments like to do their own thing and not work together at that scale, but it’s the same incentive for currency not being owned/backed by any government or organization and instead just backed by code
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but what's the benefit of it 'being backed by code'?
11:16
I mean how would you even store medical records 'on the blockchain'
11:16
you likely don't want to put all the data there, because it's too expensive
11:16
so you link to it
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So from the currency perspective, if the USA(my country) is in debt they can print money, but being backed by code, no one can print bitcoin
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why are you talking about money?
11:16
I wasn't saying that cryptocurrencies make no sense
11:16
I was asking about uses for nfts
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heinrich5991
so you link to it
at that point, you might just share the link instead doing stuff 'on the blockchain'
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But the sharing of the link to it is exactly what an nft is
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I can also share a link without an nft
11:17
to my medical data
11:17
what value-add does the nft have in that use case?
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So it’s more that everything can be done in this ecosystem -system and it is all secure
11:18
Like yes you can do it using another method
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you haven't yet said any benefit
11:19
I can also share my medical records while playing the flute
11:19
like yes, you can do it using another method
11:19
it's more that everything can be done while playing the flute. and it's all more fun 😉
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that is true, the flute is fun
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no the flute sucks
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The current things that exist on blockchain are typically in finances because ppl like money, there's 'banks' with loans and interest and all that, there's markets to trade things, but what's starting to be developed now since the hype from making money is starting to die down is actual infrastructure to move all types of data on blockchain
11:23
medical records is one thing, but the fact that we are able to securely transfer data in that way on a public blockchain is insane
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okay, if medical records aren't a good example, I'm also willing to listen to any other example where nfts are useful
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I mean like I also said it could be ownership of anything, like the deed to your house, any valuable you have, there could be warehouses of items owned by people that could be freely traded without having to have physical possession of it, but that's about it for nft's specifically
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okay, so you say that having 'your house' on the blockchain is a value-add?
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"The NFT doesn’t convey ownership of the copyright, storage, or usage rights to the asset itself. As White explained, when someone buys an NFT, “They’ve paid to have their wallet address etched into a database alongside a pointer to something. I wouldn’t say they really ‘own’ anything at all."
11:26
This is what an NFT is, simply, that's dumb af
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heinrich5991
okay, so you say that having 'your house' on the blockchain is a value-add?
you could take a mortgage out on your house for example in a decentralized way
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what guarantee would the holder of the nft have that it really corresponds to your house? how do you make that connection between the real and the blockchain world?
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ReiTW
"The NFT doesn’t convey ownership of the copyright, storage, or usage rights to the asset itself. As White explained, when someone buys an NFT, “They’ve paid to have their wallet address etched into a database alongside a pointer to something. I wouldn’t say they really ‘own’ anything at all."
It's not about actually owning something like images, obviously you don't own the bored ape image, it could be attached to physical things and that would be real ownership but would have to be agreed upon by people and governments
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heinrich5991
what guarantee would the holder of the nft have that it really corresponds to your house? how do you make that connection between the real and the blockchain world?
it's the same thing as a long time ago when there was a physical paper to be a deed to the house and that would prove ownership, it's about the people and governing bodies agreeing that it has value
11:29
Also NFT's are like a really small part of the whole crypto development idk why they get so much hype
11:30
I mean it does have a lot of value
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Skystrife
it's the same thing as a long time ago when there was a physical paper to be a deed to the house and that would prove ownership, it's about the people and governing bodies agreeing that it has value
but then the decentralization goes away
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but its literally just a pointer to metadata
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the government isn't likely to say that "oh yes, there was a bug in the smart contract of all the plots in this country. now the person who hacked the contract owns all of the land of germany, that's fine"
11:31
so it's still the government ruling over which trades are fine and which are not
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Skystrife
Also NFT's are like a really small part of the whole crypto development idk why they get so much hype
we were talking about nfts because you said that they were useful
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heinrich5991
we were talking about nfts because you said that they were useful
they are!
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but what for?
11:31
I don't see how the house example is a good one
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ok how about a simpler example that doesnt require years of understanding from millions of people to agree on it working
11:32
have you ever played CSGO?
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I did
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what if you could actually own the skins
11:32
and it's not at the mercy of the game developer whether you can sell your $100 skins
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you're always at the mercy of the game developers
11:33
they can just say that they don't accept your $100 skin if you sell it
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you can just send it to someone else and trade like everyone else does
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yes
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but if you get trade banned then you cant
11:33
if it's on the blockchain as an nft you can
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no, you can't, or at least not in a useful way
11:34
the game company says "we're not accepting the nfts currently held by @Skystrife anymore"
11:34
you still 'own' something, but it's not of value as a skin anymore
11:35
the game company is the ultimate arbiter of what happens in their game
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That obviously depends on how they implement it, but you could have a game that makes it fully decentralized
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okay, so you get your fully decentralized game
11:36
then I'm just gonna copy your skin and it looks just like yours
11:36
the only difference is the author
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That's just not how it workes
11:36
works
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okay, so you only accept nfts from a certain contract?
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correct
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where's the decentralization?
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A decentralized autonomous organization (DAO), sometimes called a decentralized autonomous corporation (DAC), is an organization constructed by rules encoded as a computer program that is often transparent, controlled by the organization's members and not influenced by a central government. In general terms, DAOs are member-owned communities wit...
11:37
I feel like you might find this really interesting
11:37
I do at least, but the gist of it is that it is completely community run
11:38
you could make an entire game or company or whatever, then have everything done in it be governed by the users
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okay, so we're at least very far away from it having to do anything with CS:GO, right?
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obviously yeah but I mentioned csgo because i figured you were familiar with the skins and trading
11:39
everything in blockchain is still very early, so it wont be adopted for a while
11:39
The research behind it is really cool though imo
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Skystrife
everything in blockchain is still very early, so it wont be adopted for a while
I don't see an incentive for valve to adopt it in any case
11:40
okay, so you want to run a community-run game with skins as nfts
11:40
do more skins get added over time?
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they could be yeah
11:40
similar to how skins are added to this game, people submit them and they get voted on
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what happens if the skin contract has a bug? the whole game is useless?
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heinrich5991
what happens if the skin contract has a bug? the whole game is useless?
that's the beauty of the DAO, there is governance and contracts can be changed based on voting
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oh, the contract cna be changed
11:41
so any random person with some money could just come in, buy a bunch of governence tokens and destroy the game?
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I mean technically not changed more a function gets directed to a different contract but yeah
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heinrich5991
so any random person with some money could just come in, buy a bunch of governence tokens and destroy the game?
governance tokens don't have to be bought or sold they could be given based on whatever you want like for a game maybe be given based on playtime or something
11:42
the options are literally limitless
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it has to be something that can be verified on the blockchain
11:43
so it's pretty limited
11:43
I don't see how you could take playtime for example, unless you can only play on the blockchain
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I mean yeah there has to be servers for a game to run so that has to be centralized somewhere, but you can interact and send data to the blockchain in a lot of ways
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but then it's suddenly not community-managed anymore
11:45
the people hosting the servers can unilaterally change the game
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ok like
11:45
DDnet is community run right
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not really?
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what?
11:46
If I want to I can come up with a feature and submit a pr and if people like it it will be in the game
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yes, ultimately because it will be accepted by deen
11:46
but if deen doesn't want to have a swastika as the game's logo, it's just not gonna happen
11:47
even if the whole community is in favor of it
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Yeah that's fair haha
11:47
I don't expect that to happen
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i don‘t think i‘m the only one with control, i‘d be ok with the other admins overruling me
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I guess you'd stop hosting the servers if it required you to do illegal things like displaying nazi signs ^^
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What I was saying tho is that this game could have some sort of blockchain interaction if people wanted it and that could also be community managed. I don't think it would help this game but its cool to think about
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but there is no democratic process. sometimes we call for a vote to see if something would be liked
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more of an oligarchy I see
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Blockchain interaction? 😕
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Learath2
Blockchain interaction? 😕
I dont think it would fit this game haha
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Each hammer hit goes on the bitcoin chain, 15 minute ping
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lmao
11:52
anyway @heinrich5991 you may not think that there's much use to nft's or blockchain in general, but I think it's really cool and although I wouldn't go and recommend people invest in crypto or NFTS, I would recommend at least ppl here(I assume have some sort of CS background) could invest in learning the technology because I do think at least in some way it will be used a lot in the future 😄 (edited)
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I think that there's not much to nfts in particular
11:52
I haven't said anything about blockchain
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I mean you are right about that, NFT's are like 2 lines of code xD
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I think I know enough about blockchains, wanna quiz me? ^^
11:53
I want to believe that because I know enough about it that I think nfts look useless
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They are
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I mean do you know about different blockchains and how they work or how NFT's work on them?
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yes, I do
11:55
well, maybe I only know how ethereum's nfts work
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Ultimately the world is centralized around governenrs, you can start playing with ur "decentralized" toys but when smth they dont like thats where it stops
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but I guess it works similarly on other blockchains
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Goverments*
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governments*
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Then you should know that what I said from the start, "the underlying technology behind NFT's is really useful" because there are tons of different things in smart contracts on Ethereum for example but also others that are built off of the NFT contracts but arent just "oh I own picture now"
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Ryozuki
Ultimately the world is centralized around governenrs, you can start playing with ur "decentralized" toys but when smth they dont like thats where it stops
sadly that's kinda true and why it will take so long for adoption
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Skystrife
Then you should know that what I said from the start, "the underlying technology behind NFT's is really useful" because there are tons of different things in smart contracts on Ethereum for example but also others that are built off of the NFT contracts but arent just "oh I own picture now"
'if you know anything about the subject matter, you'd have the same opinion as I do'?
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PoW = making our current climate problem even worse btw
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but there's PoS, so that's not a great argument
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heinrich5991
'if you know anything about the subject matter, you'd have the same opinion as I do'?
nonono I'm not saying that haha i'm saying that my point originally wasnt even that NFT's are good, but the tech behind them are
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sadly don't have skill about blockchain, only know that irl ur in a trust system where u have to trust anybody while blockchain solves that with a proof state
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heinrich5991
but there's PoS, so that's not a great argument
There are downsides to that iirc
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Ryozuki
PoW = making our current climate problem even worse btw
Actually tho in the long run it could be good
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Ryozuki
PoW = making our current climate problem even worse btw
less than actual system lol
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PoW caused so many solar farms to be built to run the crypto farms
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One of the biggest criticisms of PoS is that it is less secure than PoW. Because PoS does not require miners to expend energy in order to participate in the consensus process, it is possible for individuals with malicious intent to take control of the network by acquiring a large number of stake tokens.
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Skystrife
Most nfts nowadays are referenced to images or whatever hosted on blockchain hosting sites like ipfs, so the thing about them going down or being changed isn’t an issue(unless they intentionally make it that way like voxel mentioned). I think the nft art thing is really stupid but the technology behind it is really cool, like an nft could theoretically represent ownership of anything, like the title to a car or property, or it could be used to hold medical records and share them with hospitals easily. It’s a good thing for technological growth that ppl are interested in making a quick buck off the art craze but if you plan on going into that I’d recommend not staying long
I took this as saying that nfts can be useful for anything. I wanted to show how I disagree with that. I didn't talk about blockchain technology in general
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and now that things are transitioning to PoS and other securing measures those farms are being redistributed to respective government power grids
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ReiTW
less than actual system lol
But currentlt it runs side by side
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heinrich5991
I took this as saying that nfts can be useful for anything. I wanted to show how I disagree with that. I didn't talk about blockchain technology in general
that's completely fair
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Not the most pleasant, even if you create folders, so that there are no messages, you need to create for each mod
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Skystrife
PoW caused so many solar farms to be built to run the crypto farms
it also caused a coal power plant to be continued
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That happened a lot less than solar bc its a lot more expensive in the long run
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[citation needed]
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true
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σℓí♡
Not the most pleasant, even if you create folders, so that there are no messages, you need to create for each mod
Is it a good idea to create a third console to output https/game/png/datafile messages?
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it'd probably be better to make the current console's output more useful
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In fact, it was only with the help of these messages that I realized that you can create a folder and put an image with the name of the mod in it, it's not very obvious, but it also clogs up almost 2 console pages. I think need a shorter notification or output to another console, the first thing that came to mind (edited)
14:09
9689301 Fix game freezing up on duplicate snapshot - Fireball-Teeworlds e8667b6 Merge #5658 - bors[bot]
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BREAKING: C++26 will figure out what you actually mean.
Likes
330
14:14
sue
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break the abi or go home
14:29
just use rust
14:48
@Learath2
14:49
big news
14:49
The Ferrocene Language Specification (FLS) is a document describing the Rust language. It was created by a joint effort between Ferrous Systems and AdaCore as one of the prerequisites for qualifying Ferrocene, a Rust toolchain qualified for safety-critical environments. The FLS is compiled of existing Rust documentation, but presented with a rigorous structure in order to meet the requirements of qualification.
>
The FLS is not intended to be used as the normative specification of the Rust language nor is it's meant to replace the decision-making processes of the Rust project. Any difference between the FLS and the behavior of the rustc compiler is considered an error on our part and the FLS will be updated accordingly.
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someone knows a map that use a color envelope on a tiles layer?
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k2d222
someone knows a map that use a color envelope on a tiles layer?
Zaiross-Gores
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indeed! thx
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I think "wait" command should be added for console. For example after binding [bind d "+right; wait 120; emote 3"] to console, pressing "d" will go right, wait 120 milliseconds and send emote.
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oguz
I think "wait" command should be added for console. For example after binding [bind d "+right; wait 120; emote 3"] to console, pressing "d" will go right, wait 120 milliseconds and send emote.
no, this would allow even more powerful dummy bind
f3 1
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7e80441 Update french.txt - Sehyn 36a54e7 Update french.txt - Sehyn f1b2d27 Update french.txt - Sehyn 9e1328f Merge #5643 - bors[bot]
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Chairn
no, this would allow even more powerful dummy bind
but, there is some legit bot clients, right?
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"legit" and "bot client" cant go in the same sentence :D (edited)
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bencie
"legit" and "bot client" cant go in the same sentence :D (edited)
idk i heard from someone and saw a bot site that say its legit
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there are no legit "bot" clients
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oguz
idk i heard from someone and saw a bot site that say its legit
it's like hearing a thief saying what he's doing is legal...
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ye he's just legally robbing a bank
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de087bd Fix shift + left click in editor (fixes #5626) - def- 53e9fd3 Merge #5627 - bors[bot]
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2022-07-26 20:13:54Z
legit crypto scam entered the chat
20:14
non irc ppl probably already got censored hrhr
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yup
20:20
I hate it when my spam gets censored
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A little trick to spam the spammers.
>
When I find a "get X free" button on a website that then asks for my email address, I like to search for the email of the company behind the website (sometimes it's on the legal page, or the privacy policy page) and I submit their email. I also make sure to check the "sign me up for the newsletter" box, to make sure the spammers get at least one of their messages.
>
I don't really know why I do this, it seemed funny a few months ago when I started and now I do it out of habit.
>
I now keep a list of emails from these spam sites, and subscribe them all to the various newsletters I find if I have 5 minutes.
21:17
haha
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@heinrich5991 would this color work?
22:29
f3 1
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💩 ray?
22:35
or wood ray 😛
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Heinrich told me the default color of the shotgun rays should match its brownish weapon color.
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poop ray
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Initally it used to be more orange
22:37
this color to be exact
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Voxel
this color to be exact
bouncing wood beam
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i cant tell the difference other than the "orange" one is more bright too me xd
22:45
colorblind xd
22:45
they both look orange or brownisch to me
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@Voxel how about matching the hue to shotgun's brown but adjust saturation and lightness so that it doesn't look terrible?
22:46
or alternatively try using this lighter orangish color from sg
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@Voxel that's good, I guess 🙂
22:50
or better, listen to Ravie ^^
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Yeah, I'll try Ravie's suggestion a bit later
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but I'm not actually opposed to the brown either
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it should be something more lively, brown laser just feels wrong
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Voxel
Click to see attachment 🖼️
good coloe
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@Ravie maybe it even looks lively when it's animated ^^
22:53
@Voxel can you tell me the hex code for the two browns?
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Make laser shader for this rays
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heinrich5991
@Voxel can you tell me the hex code for the two browns?
sure one second
22:55
Darker: IN: #8D673E, OUT: #301D0D Lighter: IN: #C37F42, OUT: #301A09
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@Ravie ingame, they look different when animated
22:58
I'm trying them out on fng
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i just took the colors from the two images justatest (edited)
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@ReiTW IIRC you guys have a teleporter which connects people to a different server, is that correct?
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it should also nicely match the normal laser color though, so something much more saturated
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@murpi not made by me but "yes"
23:01
but imagine it just as a homemade internal proxy
23:01
you fake the change map
23:01
but you're still connected to the same port
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brown/orange is fine
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@Ravie try it ingame 🙂
23:10
cl_laser_inner_color $8D673E; cl_laser_outline_color $301D0D
23:10
cl_laser_inner_color $C37F42; cl_laser_outline_color $301A09
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What if actual real tiles existed in ddnet to switch to another server
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heinrich5991
@Ravie try it ingame 🙂
not a fan, it looks really dull compared to normal laser
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Could be cool but I doubt it is useful for DDRace
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Ravie
not a fan, it looks really dull compared to normal laser
you have tried it ingame?
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nice 🙂
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here I used the HSLuv color space to match the hue to shotgun's brown but keep the brightness and saturation of normal laser
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that also looks similar to the shotgun 🙂
23:12
can you paste the rgb hex values?
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quite a nice match
23:14
it's c38100 for fill and 20190b for outline
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now that I've seen the other, this one looks a bit bright 😄
23:15
cl_laser_inner_color $c38100; cl_laser_outline_color $20190b
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darker color better imo
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bind x "toggle cl_laser_inner_color 11206590 $c38100; toggle cl_laser_outline_color 11176232 $20190b" to compare
23:26
if you switch back and forth, the "intensity" is very similar
23:26
also this method can be used to make any other hue of laser and it will match nicely
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