DDraceNetwork - general

DDraceNetwork

DDraceNetwork / general

This channel is for all Teeworlds/DDNet and related chat. Gameplay questions can be asked here as well rather than in #questions. Ingame screenshots and any other Teeworlds related media goes to #showroom.

Between 2021-11-03 00:00:00Z and 2021-11-04 00:00:00Z

Ya def

@Ravie hi noby

ᶰ°Konͧsti

@Ravie hi noby

stop fake nobi 2021

a drone

05:07

a motorbike

05:08

skeith

why are usa servers so shit...

05:20

crying

USA sucks

play on usa1 for now

yeah servers are freezin hard rn

the new usa1 has been great for me

if youre having any troubles with US servers please DM @snail (edited)

justatest

a

Skeith

play on usa1 for now

If the problems on USA2 keep up, should we shut it down or keep it running?

Probably not worth to keep it running, if people complain about usa1 having terrible ping, maybe look for a different texas provider, but I think USA1 is fine for now

theres some 2mf blocking in multeasymap

08:33

45.144.246.100:8320

words

names: seems and theres another just 2 veritcal lines

go to #reports and ping @ moderator with server ip (edited)

Hey! Can you change the skin of your dummy?

Steinchen

Hey! Can you change the skin of your dummy?

there is a button, "Dummy something"

08:47

tick it and u can change

oh, just found it under player. "dummy settings" thanks!

Tf going on in #records

XD

5 people just beat Luna in 5 mins kinda sus

09:46

5 sec

i did 4.58 xD

Bug

the map pichummy doesnt work

09:52

all switches are bugged (edited)

09:52

you can't do the parts

draggers?

09:53

you need a restarted server, sorry about that

as soon as you entered the server shutdown so i guess it has been restarted

yes, i did that

ok there is still something i would haave never espected to happen that did

10:07

with blue tele

10:08

Image attachment

10:08

i hooked him so he go into cp 8

10:09

but didn't land on platform, i hold him for a while with endless and then this

10:09

non-sens

10:10

i didn't have time to go up, the dummy felt down

justatest

1

@Starkiller failed there many times @Sama

wierd

deen

Most popular skin accesses today that failed

i thought toptri (my skin) would be at least somewhere there in the end :|

Image attachment

11:02

i mean its a cool skin, especially if u edit its colour :(

yep seems legit to me

Image attachment

12:14

these are literally the only legit finishes

Image attachment

Axi v2.0

i thought toptri (my skin) would be at least somewhere there in the end :|

toptri is a default skin so no requests failed

Broso56

yep seems legit to me

?

Smetanolub

?

there is a bug going around on the map luna where yo ucan skip the ~~start~~ map entirely (its 6 am i made a stupid typo xd) (edited)

send dem0

I've just headed to bed

13:46

Im sure there's a few peeps you could find for a demo (for the record I did the bug but under unused name)

ඞ

MR.Plazma

ඞ

monkalaugh

does anyone have a good/correct explanation of why stopper tiles are easily skipped with speed

bad implementation from the teeworlds team

NEW F-CLIENT RELEASE VER. 3.3

Fixed sending wrong DDNet version, leading to doors always shown as opened on new DDNet servers

https://fokkonaut.github.io/F-Client

louis

does anyone have a good/correct explanation of why stopper tiles are easily skipped with speed

Um, it's not really an easy subject. But the gist of it is that teeworlds works in ticks, although your movement appears smooth and continuous you are moving in discrete steps, 50 steps a second to be exact

22:36

When you move too fast these steps become too large and it ends up that you step over the stopper

so like kill?

22:38

it seems a lot easier to skip stopper though

For some tiles we fixed this issue, instead checking all the tiles between the last step and the current position, but for compatibility reasons we kept some tiles skippable

22:38

Fwiw iirc stoppers are not supposed to be skippable

oh lol

22:39

in my experience theyre one of the easier tiles to skip (edited)

Im not exactly sure, maybe we did leave them skippable because some freak map used it as a speed gate or sth

i also remember stoppers having a really large hitbox

22:40

but somehow theyre easier to skip than kill

Kill tiles have a larger hitbox as you know making them the hardest to skip of the skippable tiles I know

22:42

You sure stoppers are skippable?

22:43

@heinrich5991 are stoppers skippable?

Wait you can go through kill tiles with speed?

Yes

Wtf

Kills and speedups are the only remaining skippable tiles I remember

Are there cheated records with kill tile skip?

Probably many, and there are maps that use the mechanic as a speedgate iirc

Can you ninja through kill?

nah

22:45

only if theyre diagonal

Actually I wonder if you can from a certain distance

I know that you can go through diagonal tele

22:46

With enough tries and luck

yeah

I think you can indeed skip kill tiles with ninja

With enough momentum sure

I think you just need to be a certain distance away and ninja thru

22:49

Just to align the ticks

how do hook and unhook tiles work then

Though kill miiight be a tad too fat for ninja to make it thru

plsplsplslol

how do hook and unhook tiles work then

Wym?

why dont you get stuck in those tiles

Learath2

I think you just need to be a certain distance away and ninja thru

Or have over 220~ velocity and dash upwards

22:49

skips at least 2 killtiles if timed right

I dont get why kill tiles are larger than tele, but smaller than normal tile (edited)

plsplsplslol

why dont you get stuck in those tiles

u can lol

plsplsplslol

why dont you get stuck in those tiles

Ah, those use a different form of collision. They will happen before the move. It will correctly check all tiles between the last and first step

Learath2

Though kill miiight be a tad too fat for ninja to make it thru

kill is too fat

22:50

im p sure

yeah but not in the same way that you get stuck in stoppers

22:51

is it just not possible to make stoppers use the same collision

plsplsplslol

is it just not possible to make stoppers use the same collision

It is. We did. But we had to revert it because old ranks and cranky old players

just make new stoppers

22:51

monkalaugh

Like how old hooktru was done? pepedead

pepedead

ye

Ye nowadays you can’t change anything in ddnet since everything is seen as a mechanic by mappers (edited)

at the same time, why not make an entirely reworked entity set

well no one uses old hookthrough now

@louis can you show how to skip a stopper? Iirc the only thing you could do was clip into one

plsplsplslol

well no one uses old hookthrough now

apparently old maps still use that and there is no absolute way of manually fixing them

Maybe release ddnet 2 and split the servers up

22:53

Like korea

yeah you dont have to force old maps ot change

22:53

just let new mappers use the new version

a new season of changes might bring life to ddnet, but it would be a lot of consideration on reworking entities

22:53

ain't gonna work that easily, since it has more bugs, than we know still

It is a nice idea, it's just a lot of work to set it up. None of us really have much time nowadays

Nor preparation on developing it, right?

Every game has bug, but in ddnet those bugs get implemented in maps lol

u can skip them with a ton of speed @Learath2

Iza

Every game has bug, but in ddnet those bugs get implemented in maps lol

Yup, sometimes I wonder if with some good adjustments, would those bugs be features as entities, such as different tune settings

maybe its not easy as i remember but i just did it

Which kind of stopper did you skip btw? One way?

even without ninja, you can skip 1 tile killtile with over 350~ down velocity + gravity

Learath2

Which kind of stopper did you skip btw? One way?

yes

22:56

smth weird just happened

22:56

i skipped thru it but it set my speed to 0

22:56

right after

Learath2

Which kind of stopper did you skip btw? One way?

Every stopper can be skipped in my experience

Lol

22:57

Try with an all directions stopper. I think those arent even supposed to let you clip

no it woirked with that too

I skipped those

if the stopper blocks have thinner hitboxes, than killtiles, then it obviously is skippable, unless it has a predictive calculation set up, like raytracing

On kobra map you can go outside of the map

cool

22:57

that might just be the prediction being wrong

That is bizarre behaviour. I wish @heinrich5991 was around as he was the one that made the changes

22:58

Ah yes, try without prediction pls

over 4 seconds of falling with 0.5 velocity / tick, times 60 as basic calculation you get around 350-400 velocity speed there

Have you ever seen those maps that use that stopper bug so you go half through the stopper and go barely under a tele? (edited)

yeah you are still supposed to clip into stoppers

22:59

but not go completely through them

monkaT

sorry too much math I've got on one of my projects, i just know it is possible to skip that

But if you can clip into them with speed, that automatically means you can go completely through them with more speed

there was my assumption on using raytracing to detect skipping tiles

Learath2

Ah yes, try without prediction pls

seems to have the same behavior with cl_predict 0 and in demo viewing as well

Well not necessarily, we could only allow clipping

louis

seems to have the same behavior with cl_predict 0 and in demo viewing as well

Bizarre :D

im asking all of this cus im making a video on tile skipping btw xd

23:00

never knew abt that weird 0 speed thing tho

@louis lemme test it out with... more details for @Learath2 -How much blocks do you consider falling down to achieve it? -May you send over the map you tested it on?

23:01

and May I check the exact coordinates with CTRL SHIFT D?

-a lot -here

643 bytes

@Learath2 stoppers a skippable, yes

23:02

are*

if u do jump up and fall without touching anything else into the stoppers u should get the 0 speed thing

Huh, I always thought they werent anymore except for the clip we left in

we decided backward compatibility was more important

Is it easy to make them non skippable?

hm I think I had it in before

Anyway, @louis the gist of skipping is ticks happening before and after a tile and not landing in its hitbox

23:06

You can visualize it in a video by drawing a line showing how much a tee is moving in 1 second, putting 50 equidistant dots on it and stretching it out

yea i was planning on doin smth like that

As you stretch it (representing getting faster) you will get to a point where the distance between the dots is larger than the size of a tile hitbox

also whats a good explanation for ticks

23:07

like each instance in which the world checks physics or smth

23:07

50 per second

Yeah sadly those are not really an intuitive concept given we humans are more accustomed to smooth continuous time :D

23:08

Nothing is smooth in teeworlds. Its not that the checks are 50 per second, its that everything is updated 50 times per second

23:09

So in reality you are teleporting a very small distance every tick, since there are a lot of ticks it creates the illusion of continuity

23:10

It's almost like fps in a way actually, but in the case of a games tickrate its not that you are capturing smooth time at distinct points but that everything happens in small distinct steps

23:10

Hopefully that's not too confusing of an explanation

yeah ill condense that somehow

louis

seems to have the same behavior with cl_predict 0 and in demo viewing as well

one last possibility is perhaps that Evolve() in gameclient.cpp is wrong

First things first: -The distance between the spawn platform and the stopper tiles are exactly 300 tiles -A simple walk off results in 152 velocity gained -But a jump is getting 154, which can be recalculated -What I think it's happening is, inperfect calculations (float values) can intercept frame by frame calculations on when to stop the player's velocity, duo to predicting positions. It has nothing to do with Antiping, since it is clientsided mostly. It is server sided apparently.

Hm but those float values are not large enough to be too inaccurate

Iza

Are there cheated records with kill tile skip?

https://files.catbox.moe/lwsry7.mp4

But I can tell, the perfect value of block measure for a whole tileskip is 306.5 blocks

that doesnt count as cheating right

it does

damn rly

no its a map bug

well its cheating but its allowed cheating

creative finish

oh lol good

Cellegen | HU

But I can tell, the perfect value of block measure for a whole tileskip is 306.5 blocks

yeah, there are probably heights less than 300 that u can hit it with

23:14

but too lazy to find them zzzz

zzzz

for now

as how I learned from Corneum that different positions from mapping tiles can affect positions for the player, this could easily be bypassed with correct positioning (edited)

23:15

who knows.

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