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DDraceNetwork
Development / developer
Development discussion. Logged to https://ddnet.tw/irclogs/ Connected with DDNet's IRC channel, Matrix room and GitHub repositories — IRC: #ddnet on Quakenet | Matrix: #ddnet-developer:matrix.org GitHub: https://github.com/ddnet
Between 2020-12-11 00:00:00Z and 2020-12-12 00:00:00Z
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can i advertise a server? i need friends
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@Wilbur Boot I think it was fine in #off-topic
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 08:24:11Z
i want to see ads @Wilbur Boot :)
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When someone with a downloaded skin join or if someone changes the skin to one from the DB that is not available locally, my client lags for up to 2 seconds or so. This report got triggered by Aoe reporting something similar on Discord, deen suggested it could be the skin downloader which made me investigate it for a bit. Thanks to cris for testing it with me. The lag appears consistently, but seems to differ in length. In races, the lag can be absolutely deadly, so I suggest we disa...
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 13:18:59Z
deen tried some D
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looks nice
13:41
did you write D before?
13:44
I didn't like how awkward it is to deep copy a multi-dimensional array
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ah yeah foreach (y; 0 .. ns.length) s[y] = ns[y].dup;
13:45
same problem exists for py btw, if you don't reach for copy.deepcopy :/
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Yes, but I couldn't find deepcopy for D
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can't find any either 😮
13:52
searching for d seems to be hard ^^
13:52
so many unrelated results
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search for "dlang"
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ah, that works in google
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Some sport tournaments (speedcubing for example, which is solving Rubik's cube for time) uses a better approach to calculate average time by simply removing best and worst times from array of tries. So we could discard about 10-15% of times when calculating average map time to make it more correct and usable. The other way to do it is calculate what is called "median" rather then average time. The median is: ``` Times.Sort(); If (Times.Length % 2 == 1) Median = Times[Times.Length / 2]...
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 17:04:18Z
@Deleted User u here?
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WAT
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 17:18:43Z
pls send the image again @Deleted User :) i lost it
17:18
and dont ghost me in tw chat u rude
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which image, the horse one? lmao
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 17:19:09Z
yes :)
17:19
i need it
17:19
and license for it
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wth xD why
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 17:19:38Z
school project
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wdym by license
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 17:19:45Z
no yt video ofc
17:19
i want ur permission to use it
17:19
and redistribute it under cc0
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there's no face on it I guess u don't need permission lol
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 17:20:21Z
u still own copyright
17:20
its ur image
17:20
learn legal bro
17:20
:D
17:20
anyways u in?
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and if you have discord I sent u on pm
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 17:47:25Z
i dont have discord u troll
17:48
go send me in tw chat or via mail chillerdragon@protonmail.com or @zillyhuhn on wire @Deleted User
17:48
or send it to @fokkonaut on discord he is my slave
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 17:50:13Z
also fix bombay server it does not allow the name length ChillerDragon :/ and also my password does not fit in max pw len
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noob using same pw on every server
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 17:59:15Z
no i dont
17:59
i just use longer pws than they allow
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 18:00:04Z
usually
18:00
i just realized my fddr pw is sok lemme fix that
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 18:17:41Z
maybe we want a bigger buffer here since sha map sums https://zillyhuhn.com/cs/.1607710491.png
18:18
wait or is the file ending .gho and not .ghost?
18:18
ah nvm its .gho
18:18
i thought its chopped of
18:19
i assume who decided on gho vs ghost also uses index.htm :D
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well, old fat only supported 3 char file endings
18:20
and 8 char names
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Christmas tourny
18:34
POGGIES
18:35
18:35
@deen this table makes the web look bad on mobole
18:35
Mobile
18:35
Cuz it puts whole page at that with
18:36
Maybe set some overflow horizontal
18:36
Or auto
18:36
Width*
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@Ryozuki can you fix it with css? I tried once and failed
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I can, when i get home
18:38
xd
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ChillerDragon sry I don't talk to noobs so i'll contact u directly
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@deen fixed
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❤️
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:15:27Z
css pro
19:15
im sure using negative margin @Ryozuki u hacker
19:16
hm overflow auto
19:16
i liked ur pr cuz im fan
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:17:17Z
u weekly star some random rust libs
19:17
i see it all
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cuz im making my own full stack rust web
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:17:33Z
i check my github feed more often than a instragram addict
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ill make a project template starter
19:17
then ill make some websites
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:17:48Z
wew
19:17
i also started my web framework
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but i found out the mustache template lib is from 2018
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:18:02Z
written in bash ofc
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so im gonna write it myself
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:18:19Z
pro
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I'm sure there are too few web frameworks 😅
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(which is definitely the reason you started it ^^)
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@heinrich5991 in rust there isnt any web framework that makes it easy like django
19:19
yea
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ah ok
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u can definitly automate 70% of web development
19:19
xd
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:20:03Z
oh ryo building next django
19:20
invest now!
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wel it will be a rly opinionated framework
19:20
that suits my needs
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:20:26Z
im sure it will be most used framework 2025
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:20:51Z
look at how all the good stuff started
19:20
all smol
19:21
java was even a temporary language :D
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idk how they started
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:21:18Z
rust was a mem
19:21
i always want to use GPL license cuz i like to enforce freedom to the face of ppl
19:21
but im not sure
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:21:47Z
its no freedom if GPL forces you to rls code
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since in rust most is statically linked
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:21:56Z
force != freedom
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well its not forcing, it ensures your freedom
19:22
since it propagates
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:22:25Z
it is not giving freedom to the devs using it
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"enforcing freedom" itself is an oxymoron
19:22
is that the word?
19:22
XD
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:22:42Z
makes licensing combination trouble
19:22
haha oxymoron
19:23
memorys to school start to fade
19:23
i think its correct
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ye it is
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:23:38Z
u so smart
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:23:48Z
wtf
19:23
pepe_straight
19:23
:pepe_queer:
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it means straight as in looking at u straight
19:24
nobo
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:24:21Z
thats homophobic
19:24
heinrich ban him
19:24
:D
19:25
it would be cool to figure out how deen writes these news, i think its markdown, if i can know i may be able to wrap dates in a span and with a little js u can show the date using ur local timezone
19:25
since now we are so international
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:27:42Z
wait wat
19:27
and where is the js run?
19:27
in my client?
19:27
or web news i guess
19:28
i think we should enforce CET to demonstrate german dominace in tw community
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GPL tries to ensure freedom of users, non-GPL usually ensures freedom of developers
19:30
I like the GPL model better
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open source is a term made by companies
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huh? no
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it allows them to use software without giving back
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by the open source foundation AFAIK
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which is not the FSF and they dont care about freedoms
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The term "open source", as used to describe software, was first proposed by a group of people in the free software movement who were critical of the political agenda and moral philosophy implied in the term "free software" and sought to reframe the discourse to reflect a more commercially minded position.[3]
19:31
according to wikipedia
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:32:25Z
well users can simply not use closed src software :p @heinrich5991
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The free software movement campaigns for freedom for the users of computing; it is a movement for freedom and justice. By contrast, the open source idea values mainly practical advantage and does not campaign for principles. This is why we do not agree with open source, and do not use that term.
19:32
@heinrich5991 what u think about using GPL in rust which is basically statically linked
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there's a power difference between users and developers
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i saw a big discussion in reddit
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@ChillerDragon
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:33:09Z
hm
19:33
b3412c2 fix pre blocks overflowing - edg-l 91d9e30 Merge pull request #109 from edg-l/master - def-
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:33:29Z
in which direction=
19:33
u think devs are stronger than the opinions of their users?
19:33
he says devs and users can have different freedoms
19:34
or rights?
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:34:11Z
"power difference"
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i would say rights
19:34
a open source license ensures the devs rights, but may not ensure the user freedom
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e.g. producers of goods have more power than the end consumer, so there's consumer protection agencies
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:35:04Z
but isnt the consumer shaping the request and thus decinding what is produced?
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well, explain why we have consumer protection agencies 😉
19:35
looks fixed
19:35
it should be fixed everywhere too
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:35:37Z
if society would care and dislike closed src there would be an disatvangae for producers to stay closed
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open source seems trendy to me
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if society would care and dislike broken products, we wouldn't need consumer protection laws that allow us to get 2 years guarantee on every electronic item
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lot of companies try now to go into open source
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no, it doesn't work that way
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well idk
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society doesn't like broken products. but that alone doesn't seem to suffice for some reason
19:36
(I'm not even talking about software yet)
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:37:16Z
hm
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@heinrich5991 well in fairness u may not be able to ensure something doesnt get broken
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add Discord Rich Presence to the client. something like this
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:37:22Z
f society then :D
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af2d499 Try to only overflow in x-axis - def-
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:37:48Z
so we need a software protection law heinrich? :)
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not software as is
19:38
digital protection
19:38
Defending your rights in the digital world
19:38
hav u seen they caught a american exposing real covid data
19:39
he is in prison iirc
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yes, we need consumer protection for the internet world as well
19:39
the eu continued in a good way with the gdpr
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:39:25Z
do we have that in ger?
19:39
yikes
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yes, we do have consumer protection laws in germany
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:39:38Z
the only thing the gdpr gave me was annoying cookie banners
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that's just companies trying (and failing) to comply in bad faith
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:40:05Z
gdpr is not more open source
19:40
i think open source is not only good for the user but also for society in general to share our knowledge
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gdpr has nothing to do with open source
19:41
its about data protection
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:41:28Z
ye
19:41
but heinrich said gpl good because it protecc users
19:42
well idk
19:42
i still use gmail and iphone so yee
19:42
so hard to life the open source lyfe
19:43
this one is bigger
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:44:01Z
wat is it
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Florida State Police Raid Home Of COVID Whistleblower, Point Guns At Her & Her Family, Seize All Her Computer Equipment
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:44:16Z
ye
19:44
but what was blown
19:44
what can u whistle blow about a virus? :D
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a covid database
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:44:41Z
oh
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Earlier this year, we wrote about Rebekah Jones, the data scientist working for Florida, who put together that state's COVID-19 database (that had received widespread praise), and who was fired by the state for her failure to fake the data to make it look like Florida was handling the pandemic better than it actually was. Governor Ron DeSantis had made it clear he wanted data showing good results in order to justify reopening the state.
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:44:58Z
why wasnt it public in the first place?
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Since then, Jones has been running Florida COVID Action, which is a dashboard of Florida COVID information, like the one she used to run for the state.
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:45:03Z
like with names and shit?
19:45
oh
19:45
feke news
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it isnt public because it shows the failure of the state
19:45
obviously
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:45:33Z
i see
19:46
whistleblwoing in the US is always such an inconvience
19:46
but its also not nice to point out ppls mistake :D
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"Once they are no longer associated with ESF8 they are no longer authorized to access the multi-user group," the FDLE affidavit said. All authorized users use the same user name and password."
19:46
LMAO
19:47
this was their security
19:47
XD
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:47:26Z
its as secure as a tw server
19:47
also only 1 admin pw
19:48
when pr usernames to vanilla ryo?
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i dont pr to vanilla anymore
19:49
they still havent decided o nthis
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:49:27Z
let me guess
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thats how fast tw is
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:49:29Z
the sounds?
19:49
xd
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:49:34Z
xd
19:50
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:50:52Z
its just too complex
19:50
:D
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[quakenet] ChillerDragon BOT 2020-12-11 19:51:41Z
ok enough troll
19:51
gn8 bois
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GDPR is a step in the right direction and many websites have decent implementations that are not abusive
19:52
As long as it's as easy to decline cookies as it is to accept them the cookie banners are great
19:53
Oh I missed the licensing debate. In that one I like the freedom for everyone approach. MIT, BSD are great licenses that don't force anyone to do anything
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"I like the freedom for everyone approach"
19:55
MIT does not ensure ur freedom
19:55
thats the thing
19:55
u just lying to urself
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It ensures the code I write is free for anyone to use for any purpose
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maybe it ensures ur developer freedom but not ur user freedom
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I don't see how that's not free
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cuz someone can use that in a private manner without showing the code or modifications
19:56
thus not ensuring ur freedom
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Users freedom to do what exactly? See the source code to anything?
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the four essential freedoms
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That's not a right granted to you as the user by anything
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> >
The freedom to run the program as you wish, for any purpose (freedom 0). The freedom to study how the program works, and change it so it does your computing as you wish (freedom 1). Access to the source code is a precondition for this. The freedom to redistribute copies so you can help your neighbor (freedom 2). The freedom to distribute copies of your modified versions to others (freedom 3). By doing this you can give the whole community a chance to benefit from your changes. Access to the source code is a precondition for this.
19:57
u just dont want full freedom, its ok
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Ah these freedoms. What law grants you these? These are freedoms you might desire, sure. But you can't get them since there is such a thing as people owning the stuff they make
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when some big company violates GPL, nothing really happens anyway, right?
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so a law has to grant u the freedoms for the freedom to exist?
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thats bullshit
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We all agree on a common constitution in the respective countries we live in, that grant us all some freedoms
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i dont see how GPL is anti constitutional
19:59
u just dont want full freedom
19:59
not hard to admit
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It's not, it is a choice you can make. But don't pretend it's freedom for everyone
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and i wonder why u think like that
19:59
ur not a company nor represent one
19:59
why would u want something that doesnt benefit you
19:59
it bafles me
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Do you think companies don't benefit us?
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it is freedom for everyone
20:00
companies dont care about you in any way shape or form
20:00
the benefit u get is like a carrot in a stick
20:00
to lure you
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They are greedy, evil sons of bitches sure. But haven't they been spending billions on research getting us innovation?
20:01
I sure would love to live in a dream world where there is no money and we all get together to improve our world
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innovation? no they research to get their pockets filled with money, if they did research they would have helped people in need
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But it's not this world
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thats also a carrot in a stick
20:01
"innovation"
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Ryozuki
innovation? no they research to get their pockets filled with money, if they did research they would have helped people in need
Exactly, they are motivated by money, status, power and in exchange they give us goods
20:02
It's a simple trade
20:02
it doesnt mean anything
20:03
I sure would love to live in a dream world where there is no money and we all get together to improve our world
why companies dont put all their money in a research for this model?
20:03
see how this innovation is pointless
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You can protect the consumer without destroying the corporations
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no you cant
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The EU is a great example of this compromise
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gdpr doesnt protect u much
20:03
the EU is not a saint either
20:04
The last few months have seen a steady stream of proposals, encouraged by the advocacy of the FBI and Department of Justice, to provide “lawful access” to end-to-end encrypted services in the United States. Now lobbying has moved from the U.S., where Congress has been largely paralyzed by the...
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Ryozuki
I sure would love to live in a dream world where there is no money and we all get together to improve our world
why companies dont put all their money in a research for this model?
Because like all human constructs they need motivation. What is there to gain for them in such a society? They are motivated by pure profit. If we share everything they can't profit
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this is going a bit astray, but a interesting convo nevetherless
20:05
i think we should reach that model and at that point "profit" would be meaningless and we would search another thing
20:05
a rly good example is star trek
20:05
there is no currency
20:05
and what they do?
20:05
advance technology and explore
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Ryozuki
gdpr doesnt protect u much
The gdpr lets me use google without giving them my entire life. I can now request whatever they have on me and I can compel them to delete it legally
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google gets ur life data anyway
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Ryozuki
i think we should reach that model and at that point "profit" would be meaningless and we would search another thing
Profit can only really be meaningless if we have infinite goods. How do you propose we partition the goods?
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well i think if everyone gets their basic needs assured no matter what people would change how they think
20:07
its true there may always be a greedy person seeking "profit2
20:07
but it wouldnt have that importance
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Well I want more than the basics. What do I do?
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right now society is based around money
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I'd say money is basically a way to distribute resources
20:09
I don't think money is the problem, just how you distribute that money
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Communism and Marxism work great if we all decide to not be humans. So we start to either cheat (USSR) or we compromise. How much do we compromise? If we compromise too much you reinvent capitalism (USA). If we try a balancing act, we get "socialism" (EU?)
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i mean
20:11
maybe getting infinite or nearly infinite resources is not something impossible
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One could argue that humans can get over their greed or that it's not an inherent feature of the human. But I don't really see how we get there without infinite goods
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u just need the technology for it
20:11
for example if we could get to the point of making a dyson sphere we would solve our power problems forever
20:11
and with infinte power u can make lot of things
20:12
A Dyson sphere is a hypothetical megastructure that completely encompasses a star and captures a large percentage of its power output. The concept is a thought experiment that attempts to explain how a spacefaring civilization would meet its energy requirements once those requirements exceed what can be generated from the home planet's resources...
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Well yes, probably. But is it really within our reach right now?
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who knows
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A dyson swarm let alone a dyson sphere is an IMMENSE undertaking for a civilization
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research and effort towards that may be a start
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It would require more materials than there is materials on earth
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but as long as u focus on short term greed u probs will never have that
20:13
@Learath2 to go to a near planet and gather resources
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It would require so much power to construct the thing I don't even know what could power it :P
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even making not all the sphere but a part would already give lot of power
20:14
thats why its possible
20:14
its a incremental game
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Ryozuki
@Learath2 to go to a near planet and gather resources
Someone needs to innovate. For that either we all pool together our resources (I don't believe it's happening unless there is an exostential threat) or people motivated by money innovate
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imagine pooling resources together
20:14
research would go way faster
20:14
covid vaccine would getdone way before
20:15
its the perfect example
20:15
secrecy slows it
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I think we should do our very best to stop the corporations from exploiting the people while they get the innovation done
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to get the juicy money from the vaccine
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Ryozuki
covid vaccine would getdone way before
Well we did get a vaccine ready in record time. There was both an existential threat and monetary motivation
20:16
It did great imo
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it could have been faster
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We dangled the carrot(money) and the companies just got it done
20:16
well idk if they are efficient but ye
20:17
well interesting convo, i gotta go eat my corporation food now
20:17
cya later
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Ryozuki
it could have been faster
Could it? I think a lot of time was spent on testing. Moderna said they had the candidate they are releasing only after a week or so of starting development
20:17
I should get to sleep, I feel so extremely tired :/
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Just wait till the first countries start to cancel their orders
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when are we banning the use of languages with pass by reference semantics?
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a few days before we decide to disallow mutating values at all
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I might become a functional language advocate after aoc, pythons transparent pass by reference semantics are exceptionally annoying
22:26
I'd honestly rather work with immutables any day of the year
22:27
did you know that copying a list of list of strs doesn't copy the strs? 😄
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yes, same in D
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wasted 2 hours
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I noticed today during aoc as well .D
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did you know that copying a list of list of ints does copy the ints?..
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Heh, that's ununituitive
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Learath2
did you know that copying a list of list of ints does copy the ints?..
python does a weird thing with numbers under 256 iirc
22:35
idk if its related
22:35
Why does the following behave unexpectedly in Python?
a = 256
b = 256
a is b True # This is an expected result
a = 257
b ...
22:37
The current implementation keeps an array of integer objects for all integers between -5 and 256, when you create an int in that range you actually just get back a reference to the existing object.
22:37
xd
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Advent of Code. Contribute to Learath2/aoc development by creating an account on GitHub.
23:07
It was pretty but in the process of trying to figure out wtf python was doing I destroyed it
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IBM and Red Hat killed CentOS 8 stable, and there would be only CentOS Stream beta OS. However, CentOS is now reborn as Rocky Linux.
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