DDraceNetwork - showroom

yes

00:05

i like it

why was he banned

00:15

im the one posting it because hes banned here too

00:15

yeah :l

00:15

00:15

but +1

@jao pin my song

what happened to moving threads to archive or wherever

00:18

who

00:18

got banned

konsti got banhammer

on forum

for what?

00:19

why the fuck

00:19

would u care if u get a forum ban

00:19

no one uses it

00:20

does someone have the text?

00:20

his complaings

00:20

why players shouldnt be seen?

00:20

idk what u mean

00:20

i complained once

00:20

in a long text

00:20

ironicly

00:20

im sure everyone wouldve understood it

i screenied cus i thought it might get deleted

but everyone just wrote tl;dr

wow censorship

dont worry jao i got it

@noby stop it

u

now when i complain

xd

i always do my best never to go at specific people

a: buse

cuz i dont want to be banned

00:24

i guess

00:24

u cant even complain indirect like that

00:24

i mean he didnt name the name

00:24

obviously we all know whats meant

what do you mean "complain inderect"? he tried to outsmart the rules, that's as wrong as straight up violating them

if the rules can be outsmarted by any random troll then maybe the rules should be smarter

no people should just use common sense and not give us a hard time

(edited)

make it clear then, finding a loophole in the rules is not a rule

00:27

common sense is just a note

00:27

not a rule

ur playing with words

people should just use ddnet client and not bot

00:28

and yet they dont

yes, but this isnt the current topic

ik

00:28

analogy

hm

using a rule that everyone should agree on

and when they bot they get punished, so when they break the rules the yget punished too..?

it was a response to [6:27 PM] jao: no people should just use common sense and not give us a hard time

00:29

trying to make the point that if people always did what they should there wouldnt need to be rules

ye so? if they don't use common sense they get banned, that's equivalent to "when they dont use legit client they get banned" (edited)

they clearly didnt break the rules. read my texts. -common sense is just a note -finding a loophole in the rules is also not a rule

whether or not a client is legit is pretty objective

00:30

common sense is a vague thing

00:30

and u cant enforce it imo

..why am I even discussing this

its ddnet that was not up to date with their rules. they should be unbanned and the rules should be adjusted in a way that they will get banned next time they do this

+1

u should be discussing this because ddnet is behind on things here

[6:30 PM] jao: ..why am I even discussing this because u are an admin

also why does the ddnet bot say "<name> left the srv" when he is banned?

00:32

just a small sidenote

00:32

and if they dont get unbanned id definitly consider that as bad judgement by admins

00:33

and that what i just said is no complaining

so people dont know they got banned

oof

it doesn't show if someone is banned, was kicked, or just left anymore because there is no reliable info for that. so now it will only say "just left the server" for anything

lol jao unban konsti from forum

00:35

A: BUSE

what do u mean no reliable info

00:36

it worked before thonkery

not reliably, happend to be wrong quite a lot

00:36

and that annoyed me

00:36

so just throw it away altogether

how is that possible

common sense was btw used. how can they outsmart the ddnet rules and not get banned. they only went to the ruleboundaries and never went past that

guys lets all relax

there is no time for relaxation right now

we can settle this in an orderly lincoln douglas debate

when someone leavs the server it doesnt dispatch how they left. I looked at the audit logs to check if they where banned or kicked but they are really weird and not reliable

audit logs should always show this ..

sometimes audit logs get "merged" together or they are delayed

btw how come the topic was just deleted instead of locked

wanted to prevent it from creating more unnecessary annoyance, but seems like it did the opposite

00:40

and ofc audit logs show it if you look at it as a human, but if you do it from code it's kinda messy and hacky

@jao. i just proved to u that they did not break any rules and only went to the very boundaries of what they are allowed to do so answe

00:41

r

00:42

or unban them

trying to find loopholes in the rules is contradicting to using common sense

common sense is not a rule

00:43

also give me the forum rules

common sense is implied

i cant even see them

since when do any forum posts get deleted

on forum

since the forum exists

only saw them get locked so far

the deleted ones you obviously don't see

is it not common sense to think of a way to bypass the rules

00:44

for me it clearly is

if someone uses the forum alot isnt there a good chance they wouldve noticed topics disappearing if it was a common thing

also i still want those forum rules, since discord and forum are not linked in a way that discord rules are applied in forum too

@noby wtf no that would be impossible

and if thats the system u guys are using

xd

then that system is absolute bullshit, since it would request a forum user to have to be on this discord

00:47

and again i dont even get a response

censorship

@ezy yea just leave hey

no ty

sad

https://forum.ddnet.tw/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2199

00:49

@ezy

ty

00:50

great

00:50

complaining isnt even

00:50

a rule

you should read more closely

also where is

00:51

use common sense

00:51

xd

"Any content that violates our User Guidelines will be removed"

00:52

"Interpretation of our guidelines is at the discretion of the staff."

really made censorship easy for u guys

00:52

lmao

well we already said that no staff was directly complained about

00:53

it is only rly the common sense thing that is also the most unclear shit ever

00:53

i could argue they used common sense

00:53

and i already did

00:53

but i still didnt find it in the rules

in my world using common sense is contradicting to trying to outsmart rules

yes so tell me where common sense is

00:54

in the rules on the forum

in the great censorship world of jao

@jao if you mind looking back to gores dc...

00:56

we should try to make a right conversation

00:56

and talk to him ffs

somewhere where he cant delete messages pls tho

jao ?

00:57

why u constantly going away mate

i guess its a no for jao

00:58

cuz "what he did was correct"

00:58

but it was not

no, what konsti did might not have been correct but it was allowed

he banned konsti for having free speech

and thats the point

it was actually allowed to speak his problems out

00:59

he didnt even broke any rules with that

01:00

@jao jeez now we are hardly punishing you really

"Interpretation of our guidelines is at the discretion of the staff." I interpreted it as a rule violation, it was obvious who he was complaining about, doesn't neccessarily require dropping names. and common sense should be implied. ddnet isn't a government that need rules for every little detail

exuse me

but ive told u

01:00

how u can improve

01:00

the rules

01:00

??!

but since when his post was violent?

01:01

explain mr. ruler

should repost konsti post here since rule 6 isnt working anymore in dc

01:02

his post was confirmed as a himcleaning

01:03

he wanted to discuss his own problems first,

01:03

but he was started talking about his behaivor on discord

01:04

man

01:04

again hows that so violent that is crosses with the actual rules?

LOL

with that force, every single fckin person who got selfdiscusses should be banned

01:05

right

@Wombat did u delete urself

i dont think he did

that was so fast

its been posted here many times

01:06

and got deleted every time

and yes i should protect konsti cuz ... with the fact that he is a troll, does not mean that he has no right

jesus that was so fast

01:08

but u didnt break any rule

01:08

rule 6 broken

...

so u allowed to post

ryozuki was banned

01:09

in discord

01:09

for sending what u have sent

01:09

he did send it 2 times

01:09

u should try another time

01:09

if u dont get banned ddnet is not judging fairly

01:09

thats a fact

you should allow post which arent against the community, the people on it, or at least not being an asshole

wombat i have no idea who u r talking about

01:10

could u explain

did jao even mentioned it BEFORE THE BAN that what he did was wrong?

well if u look at the rules, they never say u cannot show screenshots of complaints do they? i mean common sense right here would be to show ddnet how nondemocratic they work right?

01:11

and there is also no rule

01:11

of loopholing

hes gone post quick

so it should be completely allowed showing that post

should i say loudly that JAO YOU PLAYED URSELF

@ezy read rule 6 on dc lol

its not us complaining

01:12

its just the screenshot

01:12

we arent doing it

read whole rule

yes showing a screenshot of an complaint

01:13

is not complaining

01:13

it might aswell be "oh look what a dumbass konsti is"

01:13

therefore it breaks 0 rules

about complaining staff member, is... it is only right, if the mentions are true, and bad for the staff member

privately contact an @deleted-role about it.

so there should be at least one reason to complain

01:14

and jao got now one

XD

is konsti a deleted-role

should i report jao

01:15

kappa no

also the point of arguing is to come up with a solution that fits for both sides right?

01:16

and not to be fake offline or just to leave the discussion

01:16

like ddnet staff

01:16

do it every single time

eh i guess the rules are supposed to be takin it seriously

01:17

but hey, who didnt break any rules here

no rules are supposed to be taken seriously, and dont forget to take the nonexistent rules just as serious

@Wombat at least dont try to take the guilty to jao

@Wombat see u in next life my friend

he was thinking that what konsti wanted to earn are complains (edited)

01:19

you doing it for purpose huh

01:19

you dont understand

01:20

konsti wanted to speak his opinions

hah

01:20

nice try konsti

and got banned without any warns i guess?

01:20

which are a bit abusive from konsti?

01:21

@Wombat i did look at gores dc

give me link

01:21

whoops

01:21

hes gone

01:21

XD

rip

https://discord.gg/eTSTNG

unlucky

who funbanned wombat

nobody

01:21

he rq

now

01:22

i want the reason

01:22

for his ban

01:22

oh wait

@jao help us out here

his msges

01:23

@jao ... have a conversation between jao and konsti... and maybe mentioning his his punishes?... and try to make himself guilty?

01:24

that would be a healthy option?

"ddnet isn't a government that need rules for every little detail" i told u in the discussion how to fix the rules with one simple adjustment is it too hard for ddnet?

01:27

maybe ddnets staff chat: "again a user wants us to fix something that is easy to fix and solves a problem" "nope we dont listen to users"

I didn’t see your suggestion

@jao so can you explain to me first: how is it possible to ban a person for having the right choises to speak with no actual violating sentences on it?

moin

01:29

delikanli

yo

bot

wuff

sitz

xd

fein

second: can you ban anybody by just following the rules and think about it twice of what the person really meant with it?

@Cellegen | HU i won’t have a discussion with him, stop pestering me with this

@jao what was wombat banned for?

okay okay i stop u

01:30

i mean myself

posting that screen

01:30

okay

so? what rules did he break?

jao unblock

here.

?

no mod complaints

01:31

no

get delikanli'ed (edited)

1

@jao unban him now

01:31

rule 6 is broken

is it only because he talked about somebody he didnt even mentioning his name???

therefore cant be enforced

bc he posted negative feedback and thats not alowed

jao pls unblocck

01:32

important

no

"Don't complain about staff members" he never did complain about anyone, he was just showing how stupid konsti was

+

(jao dont make 31)

also rule 6 still broken

also ryozuki never complained himself

01:33

showing a screen is no reason for ban

negative feedbacks from somebody who has rights (like everyone else) should as equaled as he mention positive feedbacks too

pls unban and fix

yes thanks for reporting, fixing that later

so no valid reason for ban on dc

jao i need to tell u smth

4

tell here

private

3

even if rule 6 was correct, it wouldnt have been broken

xD??

01:34

why whatsapp

xD

cuz discord too hard

01:34

to go into private chat

u blocked me there too

1

2

=

‍❤️‍

=

️‍

ddnet is being ignorant

@noby racist

u

fv

f3

jao now quick pm

at least should inform konsti for why he was getting punished for, you jao said it was violated which is not exactly true

1

2

wouldnt be easier that just delete his post and say to him that nothing happent there?

wtf loophole

01:38

ban

well u know what

01:38

we can say

01:38

tell me the reason bitch

01:38

here

01:38

cuz this is not the forum

right this is the ddnet discord

01:39

oh wait both get censored

like the difference between the forum and the discord should be connected

01:39

....

maybe make the rules universal?

there will be deleting chaos

do not connect them tho

01:40

connecting the forum and discord would require the user to be on discord to know all forum rules and the other way around

01:40

would be dumb as fuck

01:41

also if someone does get banned unfairly, and the rules get overwritten and corrected

01:41

that guy should get unbanned

01:41

since at that time it was allowed

01:44

also wombat got banned for: jaoheute um 02:30 Uhr posting that screen here are the rules: #1 Always be respectful #2 No NSFW content #3 Don't spam #4 Use channels only for their named purpose #5 Keep the main language to English #6 Don't complain about staff members #7 Use music bot commands only in : #voice-text what rule did he break?

01:44

same goes for ryozuki

good night guys

good night brownbear

thanks

probably #1 should be personal option, but more likely is higher the chance for ban yourself out

he broke #6 (edited)

and did u tell him?

01:51

that he broke that?

01:51

#6 didnt mention its violentity

01:52

and he didnt describe anybody

01:52

only the main purpose of his problem

01:52

gotem (edited)

violentity

.-.

he posted the screen once, I deleted it. that was the warning. he posted it again, actively ignoring that warning. he gets banned

maybe he thought it was a bug

he was well aware of what it was

i talk about konsti still :v

01:55

not wombat

you can stop talking about konsti, he won’t be unbanned

your choise

the other 2 didnt brake rule 6 tho

who should they have contacted

well nobody really bullied jao for his action sooo

01:57

but wombat did

01:57

with konsti

01:58

jao when unblock whatsapp or dc

@ezy i will try to reword the rules, which one is not 100% clear to you

01:58

never

why

01:59

bro

01:59

jao stop 31

no need for rewording any rules

01:59

add

01:59

no loopholing

@J$ON why you even talking ? trashtalking your friends

so its clear for everyone

not clear for all of us

@EddY ????

maybe make rule six

02:00

yes

ok I will add something along the lines of it

@EddY lol wut

reword that

@EddY u have no clue why i wanna pm him

and everytime someone does somehow do smth that should be banned but isnt in the rules

02:00

new rule

02:00

dont ban him

02:00

since it was allowed at the time

02:01

also make use common sense a rule

02:01

Note: Use common sense and best judgement at all times. if it doesnt say its implied

02:01

then its not implied

02:02

make it a rule

02:02

no actually dont

02:02

common sense is smth that can go in a lot of directions and still be right

Pls make ezy to moderater

funny

pls make noby to helper

funny

xd

ezy chill

02:04

in others perspective, he deserved it

im happy rn

02:04

yes its correct

02:04

i never talked about deserved or not

then what is your point here? complaining about the rules?

u just cant ban for deserved

02:04

xd

amm ye which are deserved, it has a reason gor

we use the rules as they are and if they are unclear and the rules say the ban is not deserved

02:05

then he shouldnt get a ban

[8:03 PM] painn: pls make noby to helper u

and also

02:05

i went on this srv

02:05

this absolut guy was there

02:05

from blockmark

02:05

we blocked each others

02:06

then we went on the block srvs since i told him he sucks ass at blocking

02:06

and i beat his ass

02:06

actually

02:07

i dont even think

02:07

konsti deserved his ban

02:07

tbh

02:07

complaining about a mod is a normal thing

02:08

if u wanna be mod thats like priority number 1

02:08

xd

02:08

to get over it

yes, complaining is normal. but do it privately

;-; konsti is mad at me

well u want the whole world to know

and not to you jao

also

02:23

since this is

02:23

the media channel

02:23

https://youtu.be/baKlKo_yn0o

tght

tght - Climbing (OFFICIAL MUSIC + LYRIC VIDEO) - teeworlds parody ...

02:23

this is most important

02:23

pin it

if you start writing like a normal human being. dont press enter after every second word (edited)

02:25

I will add that to the rules

1

wtf

02:26

its just a write style

the so called spam writing style

u write something and then u find something that needs to get added

then u edit the original message using the edit function (edited)

and so on, also its not spam obviously since the text is not meaningless

02:27

edit function takes forever

it spams the message history

now this is actually getting out of hand. u want to forbid someone how to type?

just get used to it

@ezy just dont type anymore 4Head

Spamming is the use of messaging systems to send an unsolicited message, especially advertising, as well as sending messages repeatedly on the same site.

02:28

they all have a meaning

02:29

my messages

wat

02:29

u

02:29

will

02:29

add jao

im so used to typing like this

02:30

and then one day i will just get banned for NOT PAYING ATTENTION TO HOW I LAYOUT MY MESSAGES?!

amm ye if you spam too much, should be deletable, not bannable

i dont consider that as spamming tho

02:38

i just add onto my messages

if it takes more than a screen, ye

02:38

i mean if you write long messages

02:39

a "merge comments" option in discord should be a good idea

basicly i only have a few extra next line characters

02:41

not even with the intention to spam

ddnet-discord-rules.md

1.61 KB

02:53

@ezy wanna give it a read

03:00

small changes

ddnet-discord-rules.md

1.62 KB

ddnet-discord-rules.md

1.62 KB

03:08

please tell me if anything is unclear or missing

instruction unclear: ban urself to be konstis friend

whats .md xd

markdown

03:11

should open with notepad

ok

03:16

u have #7 2 times

03:17

on spam

03:18

in e.g. add ,reactions

03:18

#6 admin not capital unless u want it to be

fixed

03:20

also shifted in-game help stuff a bit

ddnet-discord-rules.md

1.64 KB

is it possible to make an invite link thicc?

03:21

with **

yea

i mean the discord invite link

I think it should be highlighted cause it's the more convenient one

ok

03:23

If you want a new nickname, request it by private messaging @jao.

03:23

maybe add that again

I allowed that for everyone

ok

03:23

ye

03:23

its good

shouldn't really become a problem

03:24

staffs have a color so you cant fake them anyways

o

03:24

add

03:24

do not fake staff members

03:24

people will fall for it

03:24

or do not fake anyone else

03:25

or smth

03:25

i mean i could fake nonstaff peope

hm I think staff you cant really fake and faking others goes under #1

03:25

or no?

03:25

I should add "don't do anything that could be rude"

03:26

to #1

idk

03:26

if u make a text

03:26

and it fits good

03:26

to #1 then yea

"#1 Always be respectful - Don't do anything or use terms that could be rude or offensive in any way."

03:27

hm sounds not good (edited)

i dont think faking would fall under that

03:27

tbh

faking someone is rude or no

ofc but i think it should have its own slot for clarification

hm I don't think it is or will be that big of a problem

doesnt hurt to add it

03:29

also

03:29

keep logs of renames

03:29

with ur bot

03:29

in another private channel

03:29

or public

03:29

idc

03:29

so u can see who is faking who if it happens

the problem is also is hard that the person someone is faking is real in the first place

03:30

not even sure we can reliably enforce that

hm

03:31

if it does happen

03:31

no first theres a difference between having the same name and faking

03:31

but if faking does happen, u will prolly get hated on if u ban them forst #1

03:32

actually i also dont think it will be a big problem

03:33

when i think about it now

why tho? intentionally faking others to annoy them/ruin their name is doing something rude and disrespectful imo

you could fake someone all this time by just changing discord name not in the srv but in all of discord

03:34

yes but people want the shit explicitly in the rules

03:35

but yea

03:35

u dont need to add it tbh

03:35

ive thought about it

ye

hasent been a problem even tho it was doable

03:35

wont be a problem hopefully in the future

btw I should add this for mods in #welcome

03:35

list of all mods

idk

03:36

i think it would make more sense

03:36

to make a new channel

03:36

#team

03:36

or smth

03:36

then do it more detailed admins ... mods: ger ... chile ... and so on

#welcome should be fine, its related + there is space

03:37

ah cant seperate into countries, don't have that info here

not necessairy, would only be a cool edition

03:38

if u have nothing to do

03:38

xd

03:38

to edit roles

I could yea

i dont think its needed in #welcome

03:39

u just look to the right and see the mods that are online

03:39

xd

could also make individual countries pingable then

03:40

but sometimes mods from others countries help on ger for example

u just make roles

03:40

ger, rus, chl

03:40

and those who help on both

03:40

u give both

should i make those roles pingable?

03:41

or just @mod

only mod

03:41

and then make every be able to do

03:41

$country ger

03:41

or smth

XD

ok I will leave this here until tomorrow, maybe someone spots an error or has something to add

ddnet-discord-rules.md

1.65 KB

03:43

and I'll do the countries thing then

also unban ryozuki and wombat

later

also remove #6. #1 already has do not be rude, which means #6 ist just there to deny all factbased criticism

#6 is not there because we consider complaining about mods as rude

03:50

it's to prevent witchhunting

theres a difference between bullying and criticism

03:51

witchhunting is bullying

it's better to just direct everything to private channels

03:52

just easier for us to deal with

criticism is there for someone to improve what theyve done wrong

03:52

it clearly goes against freedom of speech

03:52

?XD

why restrict things to private channels, i think its better if everyone is allowed to give their opinion on the matter

that's intended

theres even a chance that people will tell the guy to stop complaining

03:53

if its a dumb complaint

jao: it's to prevent witchhunting

what is witchhunting lol

why would u intentional go against freedom of speech tho?

03:53

just think of it as bullying

03:54

a lot of people go after one person

because the trade is worth it

03:54

it just makes it a lot easier to deal with for us

it might be worth it for the staff team but for the community as a whole its not worth it at all

03:55

everyone hates it

and it's also not completely removing your freedom to voice your opinion, just have to do it in the appropiate channel

03:55

why tho? the only reason for hating it is if you wanna try to cause a witchhunt

criticism isnt hating

critism in private is as good as in public

so allow it

once again, you can still voice your complains, just have to do it in private

the point of groups is to inform everyone and state ur opinion

yea but believe me, it's a pain to deal with people trying to hide their witchhunt as a normal "complaint"

03:58

if it's a legit complaint it will do its job via pm too

yes but there are people who want to criticise someone with pure facts

then do that in private?

03:59

not holding you back to pm that guy

i guess

04:00

u could just mute in dm tho

04:00

i mean block

thats their right

speaking of rights...

or if you believe that is missbehaving, contact an admin

04:01

you have the right to criticize, they have the right to ignore it

now lets say there is a shitty unfair mod. u tell an admin dm what he does and the admin ignores. what do u do? well tell the whole world how shitty of a mod he is because u want to get kicked out because he is unfair

04:02

thats why it should be allowed here too

04:02

cuz admins not listening

gotta live with the admins decisions

04:03

you are not here to force your opinions through

sometimes it is very necesairy to force an opinion tho

like?

how about the mod banning u unfairly, the admin not listening

04:05

what do u do