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DDraceNetwork
Development / developer
Development discussion. Logged to https://ddnet.tw/irclogs/ Connected with DDNet's IRC channel, Matrix room and GitHub repositories — IRC: #ddnet on Quakenet | Matrix: #ddnet-developer:matrix.org GitHub: https://github.com/ddnet
Between 2017-11-29 00:00:00Z and 2017-11-30 00:00:00Z
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@Learath2 bitcoin at 10k wtf (edited)
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strongly considering cashing out so I can buy back in when it inevitably falls
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ᶰ°Konͧsti 2017-11-29 02:42:27Z
@ZimE dont talk with the Traitor feelsbadman
feelsamazingman 1
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mfw the cheating rat is back
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ᶰ°Konͧsti 2017-11-29 02:43:13Z
Fake news, I'm Mr. Neverhaxx feelsamazingman
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no u
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@Learath2 bUt BiTcOiN iS a BuBbLe
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I'm completely fine with it being a bubble as long as it keeps making me pocket change
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@Learath2 i think i invest 10 bucks
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can you pls go hack an exchange or sth so it starts dipping so I can get more
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 11:13:21Z
create own coin like moincoin xd @Learath2 (edited)
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Shelzy Madara 2017-11-29 11:38:31Z
Waw
11:38
I m a stealer of teecoins
11:39
kappa
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 11:45:36Z
yee go teecoin
11:45
ddnet points = teecoin
11:45
lel
11:45
finsihing maps = mining
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Shelzy Madara 2017-11-29 11:56:25Z
xD
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@ChillerDragon Starkiller richest boi
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 12:05:39Z
hehe tru
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New DDNet Client update with ingame Miner! Earn Points for finishing maps is oldschool, earn points for mining!
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Isn't that why TW client always used 100% cpu?
15:13
seems like i get an error when cmake downloads googletest (edited)
15:19
nag @Learath2 about it if you want it merged
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you should also add a option to specifically dissable gtest
15:19
option(DOWNLOAD_GTEST "Download and compile GTest" OFF) #${AUTO_DEPENDENCIES_DEFAULT})
15:19
instead of using autodeps
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-DDOWNLOAD_GTEST=OFF (edited)
15:20
to much typing
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or disable it in the config
15:20
then wait for the PR
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ill wait for it
15:20
disabled gtest for now
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<Learath2> heinrich5991: was it not disabled as default?
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not on windows
15:21
because no windows user is going to have deps installed
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<Learath2> is it disabled as default with the PR?
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no
15:21
but it fails gracefully if it doesn't work
15:21
i.e. it will not hinder compilation of the rest
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also idk why it fails to compile
15:21
or wathever
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your git seems broken
15:21
look at the error message
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<Learath2> doesn't make sense to me, you want to do tests you either do -DDOWNLOAD_GTEST=ON or have gtest, if not make test failing makes more sense
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git submodule does not work as expected
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<Learath2> then cmake failing
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git version 2.14.1.windows.1
15:22
is this outdated?
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I don't know
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<heinrich5991> Learath2: cmake won't fail with the new PR
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well latest is 2.15
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<heinrich5991> but it'll still allow people to run tests without doing any configuration on windows
15:22
<Learath2> heinrich5991: but it still runs gtest related steps
15:23
<heinrich5991> yes
15:23
<heinrich5991> only on first run or when CMakeLists.txt changes
15:23
<heinrich5991> afk for quite some time :)
15:24
<Learath2> many people building don't care about the tests tho :/
15:24
<heinrich5991> so where's the problem?
15:24
<heinrich5991> it will download gtest
15:24
<Learath2> they are getting the steps done whether they like it or not :D
15:24
<heinrich5991> yes
15:24
<heinrich5991> they can configure it if they care
15:24
<heinrich5991> anyway, afk for quite some time
15:24
<Learath2> sure, i'll merge it
15:27
seems like running it 2 times made it work
15:27
all so weird
15:34
15:34
this opengl 3.3 error still there :o
feelsbadman 3
banhammer 3
ddnet_icon 3
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@deen i compiled with bam now, no more floating point effects ❤ (edited)
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<deen> weird, so cmake is passing wrong parameters
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on windows btw
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<deen> probably a log from cmake build would help us
17:36
<deen> and from bam
17:37
<deen> so that we can compare
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ᶰ°Konͧsti 2017-11-29 17:41:48Z
@ZimE delete Windows, use Linux feelsgoodman
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<nemo2> heh. I keep windows around even though I've been a 100% linux user since 2001
17:42
<nemo2> just in case I need to return the laptop really
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woah, in 2001 I had first computer
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<nemo2> seems silly to throw away something with some marginal value. So I go into windows, turn off as many services as I can, turn off restore points, remove swap, turn on full drive compression, uninstall any preinstalled stuff.
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without network connection D:
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<nemo2> Then defrag
17:43
<nemo2> and then shrink the partition down
17:43
<nemo2> used to be I could defrag in safe mode but that seems no longer possible
17:43
<nemo2> usually gets windows down to like 20 gigs or so. still a waste of space but, eh...
17:44
<nemo2> Savander: heh. my very very first laptop was bought for me by my mom in 1996 ☺ my very very first computer tho was a trash-80
17:44
<nemo2> (TRS-80)
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i was born in 1996.
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<nemo2> O_o
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<nemo2> feels old
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wew im from 2000
17:45
that special year
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I remember, that we had windows 95 in these times
17:46
And noone from my family, knows about Linux
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:46:08Z
u are never 2000 @Ryozuki xd (edited)
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:46:35Z
ur like 25 yrs old m8
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<nemo2> heh. there was a time I had every DOS command memorised. was super scornful of wyswig document tools. wp51 for-ever who would ever want a tool where your formatting marks are invisible
17:46
<nemo2> but did end up on windows for a few years
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i'm from 2000 want it or not
17:46
🤷
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:46:55Z
fake news
17:47
im never older than u lel
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why not?
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:47:32Z
because it feels wrong
17:47
xd
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Does it matter ?! 😃
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:47:47Z
i guess no ._.
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not my fault i'm from 2000 :D
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<nemo2> Savander: you know, my first (crappy) game program is almost a decade older than you ☺ I was showing it to heinrich5991 the other day.
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ohh i want to see it too
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:48:35Z
lal
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like from 1986 ?
17:48
I mean, it's very interesting
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It was hard to learn program those days
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<nemo2> actually. not a decade older... more like... hm.
17:49
<nemo2> 6 years older I guess
17:49
<nemo2> hard to say. rescued it from an old floppy and didn't note down the date
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Understandable
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<nemo2> still runs fine in dosbox + qbasic ☺
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I think, in Poland
17:50
it was pretty hard to has computer in 90s
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yeah my fathers didn't even had one
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<nemo2> there was a real incentive to learn to program at the time since my first DOS PC had exactly 2 games
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pretty expensive
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<nemo2> nibbles and gorillas
17:50
<nemo2> so made games out of sheer boredom w/ the options
17:51
<nemo2> It was neat that nibbles and gorillas were so easily modifiable tho - could learn basic just by screwing with their code
17:51
<nemo2> we'd make like overpowered bananas and weird cities
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What was the language, you used in your maze?
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<nemo2> BASIC
17:51
<nemo2> it's not really a maze
17:52
<nemo2> I was a kid. didn't know maze algorithms
17:52
<nemo2> enemy is not very smart either
17:53
<nemo2> Savander: if you really wanna try it can help you get qbi, send me a /msg ☺
17:53
<nemo2> no idea what network you are on right now
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The problem is, that i don't have IRC just discord 😛 no /msg func
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<nemo2> ah
17:54
<nemo2> oh well
17:54
<nemo2> Savander: https://hedgewars.org
17:54
<nemo2> use the chat link on the header ☺
17:54
<nemo2> and. IRC foreva
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:54:38Z
17:54
xd
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<nemo2> yeah. that was my win screen
17:54
<nemo2> I was an angsty youngster at the time
17:55
<nemo2> I'm sure I thought it was edgy
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:55:04Z
haha
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I will, but later 😃 I have to go now
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:55:34Z
how old r u nemo2? o.O
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<nemo2> apparently a lot older than you kids 😝
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:55:55Z
ikr
17:55
but how old?
17:56
.__.
17:56
do u still play teewoods nemo2?
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<nemo2> I do in fact play teeworlds, sometiems
17:56
<nemo2> ddnet was new
17:56
<nemo2> heinrich5991 introduced me to it last week
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:56:50Z
thats kewl
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<nemo2> is more fun than teeworlds IMO
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but, I have to say. That I will never call myself as a Programmer. To be honest 😄 At least, not in next 10 years
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:57:04Z
teeworlds is more fun than teeworlds?
17:57
gg
17:57
is ur teewoods name also nemo2?
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<nemo2> well. heinrich5991 only showed me one map
17:57
<nemo2> but it was more puzzle/strategy than teeworlds was
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:57:49Z
teeworlds = teeworlds mate
17:57
xd
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I think, you talking about modification to teeworlds, DDRace
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<nemo2> yes
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:58:03Z
its still teeworlds lel (edited)
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<nemo2> well. code has forked
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That's right, it's more interesting
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<nemo2> reason I'm addicted to Hedgewars and still contributing code after a decade is that the strategy aspect.
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:58:29Z
i can play it with vanillla teewoods client
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<nemo2> teeworlds I mostly just jumped around and shot wildly
17:58
<nemo2> maybe wasn't very good at it
17:58
<nemo2> but didn't hold my attention as well
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Teeworlds is pretty hard to skill up
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<nemo2> this fork seems a lot more fun
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:59:21Z
it is
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<nemo2> heh.
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I think, that's why people stay to this game for a longer period
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<nemo2> he did have to explain to me how to get through the maze
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Like, I started with Teeworlds 10 years ago
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 17:59:54Z
ur tw player since 10 yrs?
17:59
lel
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<nemo2> it's also probably just I've never been a huge fan of RTS as a genre
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:00:01Z
thats long
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<nemo2> I normally play TBS and RTS
18:00
<nemo2> er
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yes, in 2008 in january or so..
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:00:19Z
kewl
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<nemo2> not a huge fan of FPS as a genre
18:00
<nemo2> typo
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Starcraft 1?
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:00:51Z
doodlejump (edited)
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or less dynamic?
18:01
I used to play StarCraft 2, it was very fun time
18:01
but a bit to fast imo
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:01:33Z
if i edit messages they dont get fixed in irc chat am i right? (EDIT: hellu nemo2 can u hear me? o.O) (edited)
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<nemo2> I do like starcraft
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Yes, bot will send next message
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<nemo2> at the time starcraft came out I switched quickly to total annihilation
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@ChillerDragon every time you edit your message, the bot will resend it
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:02:04Z
ah kk
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<nemo2> which had waaaaay better mechanics
18:02
<nemo2> Spring is the FOSS version of that these days
18:02
<nemo2> and warcraft ofc before starcraft
18:02
<nemo2> I lost a warcraft tournament in college due to final battle being same day as date w/ SO ☺
18:03
<nemo2> If you guys are up for TA:Spring btw would be happy to update my build.
18:03
<nemo2> haven't played it in a little while
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:03:35Z
basic sytnax looks great btw nemo2
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<nemo2> basic syntax of?
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nemo: afk again :/ can talk about crosscompilation this evening maybe?
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:04:05Z
ur game
18:04
maze.bas
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<nemo2> heinrich5991: oh. that'd be great
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:04:14Z
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<nemo2> heinrich5991: yeah you saw we had an OSX user asking again
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:04:20Z
especially that
18:04
what is it doing?
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<nemo2> ChillerDragon: just some win or loss graphic I imagine
18:04
<nemo2> ChillerDragon: /msg me and you can try it ☺
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:05:01Z
/msg
18:05
xd
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<nemo2> I'm obv kinda proud and embarassed of my kid code at same time
18:05
<nemo2> you can see for example I didn't really grasp functions
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:05:32Z
im to lazy to install some haxxor embedded alien system dos machine
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<nemo2> O_o
18:05
<nemo2> sudo apt-get install dosbox
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:05:51Z
sudo apt-get unilstall windows_fucking_10
18:05
xd
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virtualbox
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<nemo2> that's a good start
18:06
<nemo2> or dualboot
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:06:13Z
nono
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I used to have dualboot
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:06:21Z
i prefer buying new hardware for new os
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never used linux
18:06
:D:D
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:06:36Z
1 os = 1 hardware
18:06
or lill chillidreguhn gez crazy
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<nemo2> Savander: why not buy like an intel NUC?
18:07
<nemo2> Savander: or... just a dirt cheap laptop - there were some very functional blackfriday deals for laptops at around $150
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Yea, but actually im looking for first job after school
18:07
and in Poland, those "cheap laptopts"
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<nemo2> if it can run windows 10 it can sure as hell run linux
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are pretty exepensive
18:08
due to our salary
18:08
😛 P
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<nemo2> raspberry pi or NUC then
18:09
<nemo2> there's a lot of cheap arm-based computing these days
18:09
<nemo2> so long as you have a screen to plug it into
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Probably I will try someday
18:10
I was thinking about raspberry
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ChillerDragon 2017-11-29 18:10:43Z
i have nuu screen
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<nemo2> hm. I wonder if teeworlds could run on gaming consoles
18:12
<nemo2> seems from its design to be less memory intensive than hedgewars
18:12
<nemo2> heinrich5991: isn't pixel based right?
18:12
<nemo2> our biggest mem cost is the collision array and land textures
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i think it's square + circles
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<heinrich5991> nemo2: yes, we're tile-based
22:46
<heinrich5991> nemo2: how do you save the collision? tightly packed?
22:48
<nemo2> heinrich5991: collision is simply a 2 byte array. so a traditional 1024x2048 map uses 4 megs of RAM
22:48
<nemo2> heinrich5991: whiiiich nowdays is really not that much ☺
22:49
<nemo2> heinrich5991: we did in fact get it running on first generation iphone. although with 1024x1024 map limit - I think we could probably have done 2048x1024 tho
22:50
<nemo2> Maps/ClimbHome/mask.png: PNG image data, 2048 x 32768, 8-bit/color RGBA, non-interlaced
22:50
<nemo2> that's the most extreme one so far
22:50
<nemo2> 128MiB of RAM to load
22:51
<heinrich5991> why is it a two-byte array?
22:51
<nemo2> as opposed to what
22:52
<nemo2> It used to be 4 bytes, I decided to crank it down since we didn't actually need that many
22:52
<heinrich5991> 1 byte?
22:52
<nemo2> heinrich5991: ah. no. it stores terrain type
22:52
<nemo2> and other things
22:54
<nemo2> heinrich5991: things are actually getting a bit tight as it is
22:54
<eeeee> in teewebs i had an optimization to only store the game layer as a bitmap (for fast collision tests), and all other layers as rle packed since rendering scans them sequentially and overhead is not that large for that
22:57
<nemo2> eeeee: yeah. we actually have 2 arrays. one for rendering and one for collision
22:58
<nemo2> we've considered RLE for the non-collision one, but haven't bothered yet
22:58
<eeeee> would be nice to research better data structures for collision as well
22:58
<nemo2> eeeee: actually we are rather wasteful since we have 2 bytes for the collision terrain flags, and 4 bytes for the pixel data
22:59
<nemo2> eeeee: in addition though there's also the gl textures
22:59
<nemo2> but at least we don't create those for empty areas
22:59
<nemo2> the one we should crank down is the pixel data. RLE would help there.
22:59
<nemo2> at this point probably won't get fixed tho
23:00
<nemo2> systems have more and more RAM - probably mattered back when we were trying to support really wimpy specs
23:00
<heinrich5991> eeeee: collision trees or sth?
23:00
<heinrich5991> like you have one big square
23:00
<nemo2> heinrich5991: hm? all collision is pixel based ☺
23:00
<eeeee> agree, generally better to spend time adding new features for 95% of your users than making optimizations for the remaining 5%
23:01
<heinrich5991> which splits into four more squares if the collision isn't the same over the whole square
23:01
<nemo2> heinrich5991: oh. no
23:01
<nemo2> heinrich5991: warmux experimented with that kind of model
23:01
<nemo2> they never did get it to work properly w/ a fully destructible pixel world
23:01
<heinrich5991> mhh
23:01
<heinrich5991> okay
23:01
<nemo2> don't see much benefit in it tbh
23:02
<eeeee> heinrich5991: i see how that supports efficient point collision tests, but do you know how to do the line segment collision thing that tw needs?
23:02
<heinrich5991> isn't that easily possible as well?
23:02
<heinrich5991> you check the squares the line goes through
23:03
<heinrich5991> which is better than the current: check after 1 "game-distance"
23:03
<eeeee> yeah but how fast is it when your tree is dense
23:04
23:04
<nemo2> they are maskable by terrain type
23:04
<nemo2> mostly used to pass through hogs and objects
23:04
<nemo2> but occasionally other things
23:05
<eeeee> uh tfw i just now realized you're coding in pascal.. haven't seen any pascal codez in a long time
23:06
<nemo2> eeeee: Rust is on the todo 😉
23:07
<eeeee> cool
23:07
<nemo2> it's a pretty C-like pascal. no OOP
23:07
<eeeee> why though?
23:07
<nemo2> why rust?
23:07
<eeeee> yeah
23:07
<nemo2> ton of reasons
23:07
<nemo2> freepascal has had many compiler bugs over time. optimises poorly, has no llvm support.
23:08
<eeeee> well i mean, C+ kind of works fine for teeworlds for example
23:08
<nemo2> we constantly get people complaining about syntax. I have relatively little sympathy for folks who can't figure out that mapping but it is a minor issue
23:08
<nemo2> rust though would free us from our occasional fails on things like failure to initialise or bad pointer math
23:08
<eeeee> we're even migrating from C+ to C++ now
23:08
<nemo2> wait. I thought that was a typo
23:08
<nemo2> "C+" is what exactly
23:09
<eeeee> haha, C+ is when your code isn't using stl or most modern C++ features but still isn't C either
23:09
<nemo2> ah
23:09
<nemo2> never seen that as a term before
23:10
<nemo2> eeeee: buuut, yeah, I wouldn't wish C++ on anyone
23:10
<nemo2> I understand if you're already using it tho
23:10
<eeeee> biggest advantage of c++ is that many people know it. i think our community would've been even smaller if we used rust
23:11
<nemo2> how many active devs do you have?
23:11
<eeeee> idk like 1.5 or so
23:11
<nemo2> lol
23:11
<nemo2> yeah. I'm not gonna worry too much about that TBH
23:11
<nemo2> rust has a decent community and I think any dev worth their salt can pick it up ok
23:12
<eeeee> fstd: are thou worth your salt?
23:13
<nemo2> eeeee: doubt community could get much smaller than 1.5 😉
23:13
<eeeee> vanilla community did
23:14
<nemo2> well. even w/ pascal we still have like 4 people still touching engine
23:14
<nemo2> so I think we'll be fine
23:15
<nemo2> hm. correction 5
23:16
<Learath2> I think on the most active periods of last year we even had 3 people working on code \o/
23:18
<nemo2> eeeee: not to mention that most of the remaining devs are fans of rust anyway sooo
23:18
<nemo2> transition will never happen w/o that anyway
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libtw2 - Some Teeworlds stuff in Rust
23:39
<heinrich5991> wrt rust ;)
23:40
<nemo2> cool ☺
23:41
<nemo2> eeeee: see. you'd still have one dev 😃
23:41
<heinrich5991> it has a MVP server :)
23:41
<heinrich5991> you can walk around
23:42
<heinrich5991> eeeee: the kind of things that happen with c++ but not with rust btw: https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/issues/946
I have no idea how that hasn't fallen apart already. :o
23:43
<eeeee> true but i'd rather have more devs in community than easy concurrency :P
23:43
<eeeee> most tw servers are not massively multiplayer anyway, work just fine with 1 thread
23:44
<heinrich5991> :)
23:44
<nemo2> we had a lot of memory problems w/ haskell in past when server had a lot of activity
23:44
<eeeee> i'd probably feel more in favor of rust if i still cared about running 128 player blocker servers
23:45
<heinrich5991> nemo2: memory problems with haskell? sounds wrong :P
23:45
<nemo2> heinrich5991: uhhhh
23:45
<nemo2> heinrich5991: seriously? ☺
23:46
<heinrich5991> oh, as in: out of memory?
23:46
<nemo2> yes
23:46
<heinrich5991> ah
23:46
<nemo2> gigabytes worth
23:46
<heinrich5991> I wondered how you'd get segfaults with haskell ^^
23:46
<nemo2> haha
23:46
<nemo2> heinrich5991: anyway. I really am skeptical that C++ would draw more devs than Rust ☺
23:46
<nemo2> personally I avoid C++ like the plague nowdays
23:47
<heinrich5991> ask Learath2, fstd for their opinion about rust :)
23:47
<fstd> fetches some WD40 just in case
23:47
<fstd> also have to sleep :( nite
23:47
<eeeee> and speaking of langs, i wish someone did rewrite gamecore in lua
23:49
<nemo2> heinrich5991: what's their opinion of haskell? ☺
23:50
<heinrich5991> it's a fine language
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<heinrich5991> why do you ask? :)
23:51
<nemo2> heinrich5991: dunno. just wondering if dislike of rust extended
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<nemo2> there's similarities
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<heinrich5991> not really rust extended :)
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<heinrich5991> IMO
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<heinrich5991> different goals
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<nemo2> I mean
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<nemo2> if their dislike of rust extended to haskell
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<nemo2> due to similar features
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<heinrich5991> ohhh
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<heinrich5991> their opinion on haskell
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<heinrich5991> dunno
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<heinrich5991> probably sth like "some academic language"
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<heinrich5991> if I had to guess
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